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Lenses for Macrophotography
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PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 3:34 pm    Post subject: Lenses for Macrophotography Reply with quote
Hi folks

I've been thinking about putting together a setup for some macrophotography. Huge magnification isn't the aim, so I haven't considered microscope objectives. 1:1 to 3:1 would be sufficient i think.

I have a Rodenstock Eurygon 4/35 I was thinking would make a good objective using a Rodenstock Apo-Gerogon 9/150 as a tube lens on a very solid Russian set of M39 bellows, using my Olympus OM-D E-M5 as the camera.

Alternatvely, I have a moderm Rodenstock Magnagon 5.6/75, which is an industrial version with fixed iris of the APO-Rodagon-D 4/75.

Anyone tried using a Eurygon or APO-Rodagon for this purpose?

Any other lenses people have used for this application they would recommend?

Or should I use a dedicated macro lens like the FD 4/100, I have a mint one of those.


PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 3:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I already know the Magnagon/Apo-Rodagon D performs well at 1:1, the reason why I wonder about using a tube lens is to get higher magnification without the issues the Magnagon has away from it's 1:1 'sweet spot':

http://www.coinimaging.com/aporod75-4var.html


PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 5:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Low powered microscope objective might still be used for the magnification range you're interested in.
As well as this, enlarger lenses, process lenses, microfiche lenses are all worth considering.

A few specific examples are listed at www.extreme-macro.co.uk which I find a very useful reference for macro even when not pushing to extremes Smile

Last edited by DConvert on Sat Jun 27, 2020 8:05 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Sat Jun 27, 2020 5:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
THE macro lenses database http://macrolenses.de/ and blog http://photographyoftheinvisibleworld.blogspot.com/ seem like a perfect fit.


PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 12:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Canon made two macrophoto lenses that were quite good -- back in its manual focus days. They made a 20mm and a 35mm. Kinda rare nowadays.

Several years ago, I decided to try a trick where you butt two lenses together of two different focal lengths, head-to-head. When you do this, you mount the longer focal length lens to the camera and the shorter to the face of the longer. You can determine the magnification by dividing the focal length of the shorter into the longer. For example, if you mount a 50mm lens to a 100mm lens, the magnification will be 100 / 50 or 2x.

So anyway, I decided to take this to great extremes. I have an old D-mount movie lens that I picked up years ago and I've never had a use for it. It's a 1/2" Wollensak, so that's about 13mm. So I took a 49mm lens cap, drilled a 1/2" hole in the center of it, then reverse-mounted the D-mount lens to the cap, gluing it in place. I then attached the cap to my Tamron 90mm macro lens and gave it a go. Obviously, if you're reverse mounting a regular size lens, then you need to get a reverse mount adapter, which can be found on eBay for a few dollars.

The magnification was awesome, like 6.9x. I shot with both lenses stopped wide open, so the image was sharp only in the middle. But the sharpness was very good. What most surprised me was there was no vignetting of the image -- although I was shooting with an APS-C camera, so I don't know how a FF camera would handle this.

The Wollensak glued to the lens cap:


Here's the subject, an old printer box. Note the Wollensak lens sitting on top:


A crop of the subject, showing what I was centering my focus in on. Note the text "Windows XP" under the MS wavy window.


And finally the image:


This was a very inexpensive way for me to get extreme macro images. It cost me essentially nothing because I already had everything I needed for this project. The little D-mount lenses aren't as cheap as they used to be, but compared to regular 12mm or 13mm lenses, they're a bargain.


PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 4:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Why don't you just use the usual tried-and-tested macro lenses - Minolta, Pentax, Takumar, Tokina, Canon nFD?

Is it more about using the oldest or most exotic equipment for you?


PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 5:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
That looks excellent Michael, I have some similar little C mounts I could try.


PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 8:52 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
cooltouch wrote:
Canon made two macrophoto lenses that were quite good -- back in its manual focus days. They made a 20mm and a 35mm. Kinda rare nowadays.

Several years ago, I decided to try a trick where you butt two lenses together of two different focal lengths, head-to-head. When you do this, you mount the longer focal length lens to the camera and the shorter to the face of the longer. You can determine the magnification by dividing the focal length of the shorter into the longer. For example, if you mount a 50mm lens to a 100mm lens, the magnification will be 100 / 50 or 2x.

So anyway, I decided to take this to great extremes. I have an old D-mount movie lens that I picked up years ago and I've never had a use for it. It's a 1/2" Wollensak, so that's about 13mm. So I took a 49mm lens cap, drilled a 1/2" hole in the center of it, then reverse-mounted the D-mount lens to the cap, gluing it in place. I then attached the cap to my Tamron 90mm macro lens and gave it a go. Obviously, if you're reverse mounting a regular size lens, then you need to get a reverse mount adapter, which can be found on eBay for a few dollars.

The magnification was awesome, like 6.9x. I shot with both lenses stopped wide open, so the image was sharp only in the middle. But the sharpness was very good. What most surprised me was there was no vignetting of the image -- although I was shooting with an APS-C camera, so I don't know how a FF camera would handle this.


Stacking lenses like this can be a great way of getting magnifications above 1:1 with very limited outlay.
I usually use either a reversed normal or wide angle lens (that I'm frequently carrying anyway) in front of a moderate telephoto.
A rough guide for the magnification you can expect is achieved by dividing the focal length of the lens mount direct to the camera by that of the lens reversed in front of it. This is the magnification of the system with the lens set at infinity, changing the focus setting on the reversed lens will not normally have any effect (it simply moves the mount further out with block focusing lenses) but changing the lens mounted on the camera should give even more magnification.

Rather than a DIY connection via a lens cap I use a connecting ring (just a few quid from e-bay) along with a stepping ring or two when needed to link the filter threads of the two lenses.

Vignetting is highly unpredictable with this technique the only real option is to try a lens pair simply holding the reversed lens in place is good enough to test the combination out.

6x life size is about the highest magnification I've managed without vignetting, but I have played with a 4mm eyepiece infront of a telephoto giving me ~40x with so little light transmission/working distance I ended up photographing a light shade the image i got looked like an attempt at photographing a planet complete with 'atmospheric' clouds. Smile


PostPosted: Sun Jun 28, 2020 2:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Ian, the 35/4 Eurygon was sold for the Polaroid MP-3 system. It is intended to be used at higher magnification than you want. No other lenses needed, just bellows or tubes to get the extension required.

I've had several of these bijoux, regard them as unusable. There are much better lenses for its intended range of magnifications. Even the humble 35/4.5 Tominon, as for the MP-4 system, is much better.

If you can manage enough extension to get to 3:1 with y'r Apo-Gerogon, just use it. Alternatively, there's little around that's significantly better than a reversed 55 mm MicroNikkor in the range of magnifications you say you want.


PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 2:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
danfromm wrote:
Alternatively, there's little around that's significantly better than a reversed 55 mm MicroNikkor in the range of magnifications you say you want.


Yep. I have two favorite reverse mount setups: Tamron SP 90mm macro <=> Nikon 55mm Micro Nikkor, and Canon nFD 200mm f/4 <=> Nikon 55mm Micro Nikkor. 2x and 4x respectively.


PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 3:20 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks for the advice, saved me much experimenting. I have a 3.5/55 Micro Nikkor, I'll have to get ab reversing ring for it.

The M39 bellows I have extend to quite a length and I have all kinds of extension tubes, so i should be able to work with the Gerogon too.


PostPosted: Mon Jun 29, 2020 9:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
If you want something in the range from 1:1 ... 3:1, a reversed (!) 50mm macro lens on a bellows is the simplest and probably best solution. For the 2.5:1 ... 5:1 range you may reverse-mount a good 35mm retrofocus lens to your bellows, and for the 3.5:1 ... 7:1 a 28mm retrofocus lens will be suitable. Retrofocus lenses are best because you have at least 40mm free working distance.

S
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