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DKL Xenon 1.9/50 379 mount?
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PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:37 am    Post subject: DKL Xenon 1.9/50 379 mount? Reply with quote

Lens has 379 factory engraved on mount like here: Click here to see on Ebay
Any idea what would this mean?


PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 2:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Probably some internal factory coding. Mine says 369. Also, I think that $160 is quite a lot for a DKL Xenon.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gardener wrote:
Probably some internal factory coding. Mine says 369. Also, I think that $160 is quite a lot for a DKL Xenon.

I was wandering if it could signify mount difference. The linked isn't labeled Retina. Is yours Retina model? I guess price is high but condition is important.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This auction show one in the retina case without retina prefix on the bezel. So assuming it is the original case not all retina schneiders are labelled as such. I have a bunch of these things (DKL lenses) at home in a bin, I will check and see if I can glean further info when I get a chance.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Kodak-Schneider-XENON-1-9-50-Near-Mint-Retina-DKL-Bessamatic-Ultramatic-Remark/264237405696?hash=item3d85c6d600:g:OjAAAOSweTFciOmK


PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 3:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Pancolart wrote:
Gardener wrote:
Probably some internal factory coding. Mine says 369. Also, I think that $160 is quite a lot for a DKL Xenon.

I was wandering if it could signify mount difference. The linked isn't labeled Retina. Is yours Retina model? I guess price is high but condition is important.


Mine is Retina-Xenon. Personally, I think DKL is DKL is DKL.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gardener wrote:
Pancolart wrote:
Gardener wrote:
Probably some internal factory coding. Mine says 369. Also, I think that $160 is quite a lot for a DKL Xenon.

I was wandering if it could signify mount difference. The linked isn't labeled Retina. Is yours Retina model? I guess price is high but condition is important.


Mine is Retina-Xenon. Personally, I think DKL is DKL is DKL.
Well I have a Vitessa DKL that won't work on my retina DKL adapters The Vitessa has the aperture on the lens not the camera (IIRC). The DKL mount was used by different manufacturers (eg Kodak Retina and Voigtlander Ultramatic and the lenses are not interchangeable on those cameras) as there are minor variations in the mount. I think you could do much better on price than that. Watch the Kodak Retina cameras for as-is and study the photos. I have at least 2 of these (and probably 8 tele-arton !) I have never paid more than 70 dollars plus shipping.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gardener wrote:


Mine is Retina-Xenon. Personally, I think DKL is DKL is DKL.


The two most popular DKL mount camera lines were the Kodak Reflex/IIIS and the Voigtlander Bessamatic/Ultramatic/CS models. They are both similar, but not identical. You can't mount an unmodified Voigtlander DKL lens on a Kodak DKL camera and vice/versa. Also the Voigtlander series of DKL lenses had some minor differences between those made for the Bessamatic and those made for the Ultramatic to account for the additional features of the Ultramatic. You can tell by the color of a small dot on the back of the lens mount. There were also some very similar DKL mount lenses made for other brands as well - Braun, if memory serves made a DKL mount camera. Also Enna, and Steinheil made some DKL lenses too. All had slight variations in mount dimensions and could not be interchanged between brands. The variations were intentional to discourage the use of one company's lenses on another marque's cameras.

That said, to my knowledge, ALL DKL lenses work fine on modern DKL adapters which allow the use of these fine lenses on modern cameras. I have a bunch of these in Voigtalnder and Kodak DKL mount and they work fine on my DKL->Sony and DKL->Canon adapters.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 10:52 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

At a guess this lens may have been produced for the Kodak Instamatic Reflex, the Retina-Xenons, apart from usually being marked as such, had dynamic depth-of-field indicators which appear to be absent on this lens.

For reference, the Retina lenses had a 58mm filter thread, the lenses introduced with the Instamatic Reflex had a 52mm filter thread. Other than these details the lenses were interchangeable.

... and just in case you're wondering, yes, I've owned and used both Retina rangefinder and Reflex cameras as well as an Instamatic Reflex and still have my Retina lenses, used with a DKL-PK adaptor on my Pentax cameras ... the Instamatic Reflex has gone to a new home Wink


PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just checked my 50/1.9 Xenon that came on an Instamatic Reflex: marked 379, focus is to 2ft rather than 3ft of the earlier lens. The later lenses for the Instamatic reflex dropped the RF cam for the IIIS, and were not marked "Retina".

DKL mount varied between camera systems, with notches in the flange of the lens to prevent lenses from mounting on camera bodies of different manufacturers. Rick Oleson has instructions for filing in all the right places.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 13, 2019 11:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is a thread on here that lists most if not all of the DKL cameras and lenses:

http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=65951


PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 12:12 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fiftyonepointsix wrote:
I just checked my 50/1.9 Xenon that came on an Instamatic Reflex: marked 379, focus is to 2ft rather than 3ft of the earlier lens. The later lenses for the Instamatic reflex dropped the RF cam for the IIIS, and were not marked "Retina".


My observation of two of my lenses backs up fiftyonepointsix as well.

In the pics below, here are two versions of the Schneider 50mm f/1.9 Xenon made for the kodak reflex/IIIS/instamatic reflex.

The one on the right, made for the instamatic reflex is without the dynamic dof indicators, has a 52mm filter size, and is not marked "Retina." It also has a more compact body shape, but has the same 2' close focus distance as the other model. It is marked 379 on the mount.

The one of the left, made for the Reflex S, III, IV, & IIIS RF, is on the left and does have the dof indicators, larger flared body with 58mm filter thread, is marked Retina-Xenon, and is marked with the number 375 on the mount.





left



right


PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is very detailed list of DKL lens options including distinctions. Perhaps mount engraved numbers could actually be added.
http://tudaer.blogspot.com/2014/02/deckeldkl-lenses-and-cameras-list.html


PostPosted: Thu Mar 14, 2019 1:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

pdccameras wrote:
You can't mount an unmodified Voigtlander DKL lens on a Kodak DKL camera and vice/versa.


Are you sure? I just grabbed a Dynarex from my Bessamatic kit and put it on a Retina S. It mounts and dismounts with ease and works just fine.


PostPosted: Sat Mar 16, 2019 3:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gardener wrote:
pdccameras wrote:
You can't mount an unmodified Voigtlander DKL lens on a Kodak DKL camera and vice/versa.


Are you sure? I just grabbed a Dynarex from my Bessamatic kit and put it on a Retina S. It mounts and dismounts with ease and works just fine.


Wasn't it that retina lenses won't mount in Bessamatic?


PostPosted: Sun Mar 17, 2019 1:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Gardener wrote:
pdccameras wrote:
You can't mount an unmodified Voigtlander DKL lens on a Kodak DKL camera and vice/versa.


Are you sure? I just grabbed a Dynarex from my Bessamatic kit and put it on a Retina S. It mounts and dismounts with ease and works just fine.


I have never been able to cross mount Bessamatic lens on Reitna or Retina on Bessamatic. I have modified some of my lenses to do just that however. Perhaps you have a modified lens? Check out the details here: http://rick_oleson.tripod.com/index-150.html

Best,

Paul