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Super-Multi-Coated Takumar 50mm full open haze
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PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 2:01 am    Post subject: Super-Multi-Coated Takumar 50mm full open haze Reply with quote

Here are 100% crops of my Super-Multi-Coated Takumar 50mm f/1.4 shot at f/1.4 and f/2.8.
As expected and seen here, fully open, this lens is pretty hazy, it keeps the sharpness, but looses that micro-contrast.

Can someone here who has the same lens tell me, if this is the same, or every copy of this lens gives same effect?
Also, I wonder if it could be minimalized somehow, maybe by painting glass edges in black color that are not already factory painted, or something else? It would be pretty cool to use this lens fully open and have the clarity like on f/2.8.

Almost forgot to tell, this is shot with Nikon D5000, which is APS-C sensor body.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 6:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I don't recall mine glowing like that, but it's been a while since I shot it.
blackening the element's edge, and the lens' internals will help with contrast, as will making sure the elements are truly clean, shinning a flashlight through the lens will illuminate anything on the elements surface.


PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 10:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alex, out of curiosity I've just checked the behavior of my Super Takumar 50mm/F1.4 which is basically the identical lens except for the the missing SMC coating. So your SMC version should at least in theory behave slightly better than mine.

It turned out that when used fully open in bright light outdoor condition my lens is behaving similar to yours; i.e. it produces the same "glowing" effect due to very heavy CA's and low contrast (although a sun shade was used). Those pictures are not really usable even if corrected afterwards in Lightroom and 100% pixel peeping mode is simply awful. Forget that.

Although I have this lens already for several years I didn't realize that up to now as it would never come into my mind to use it fully open under such circumstances. The pictures are heavily overexposed even at aperture times of 1/4000 and have to be corrected afterwards anyway. So I normally would stop down to at least F5.6 for such purposes and then the lens is working excellent.

On the other hand if used indoor and/or for rather low light conditions fully open those artifacts will not occur. I've done recently a comparison of my fast 50's ( http://forum.mflenses.com/comparison-of-fast-50s-t76796.html ) where you can see that it's working fine under proper conditions even when used fully open and definitely not worse than any other lenses in that class.

Conclusion: Use it only fully open when it really make sense. Then this lens is very good to excellent which explains also the excellent rating at Pentaxforums for that lens.

BTW, I like the Bokeh very much.

Cheers,


PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 11:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Sample picture from my ST 50mm/F1.4 when used fully open outdoor under proper conditions:



PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 3:57 pm    Post subject: Re: Super-Multi-Coated Takumar 50mm full open haze Reply with quote

AlexKV wrote:
this is shot with Nikon D5000


was the lens modded?


PostPosted: Sat Mar 04, 2017 5:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, my S-M-C Tak 50 behaves similarly. You have to handle it with caution on f/1.4 as tb_a shows Smile


PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 3:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

This is typical for this lens design. It's great for portraits. Today's 50 1.4's are getting huge to prevent this, but I think it has it's charm in certain situations.


PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I just grabbed a random S-M-C Tak off the shelf and shot it wide open at the house across the road. This a 100% crop from the center of the frame, shot with t5i.



PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Modern Photography's excellent article "LENSES: Facts and Fallacies" addresses justly how lens performance varies with aperture, focal length, etc. I have just rescued the lost images from the original series of posts that presented and discussed the MP article. The images were lost when the forum had a technical problem a few years ago. The index for the series of posts is:

INDEX

Sharpness - Just What Does That Mean?
Sharpness - Can It Be Measured?


Do-It-Yourself Lens Testing
How Does Aperture Affect Image Quality?


Aperture vs. Ultimate Sharpness vs. Depth of Field

Are Faster Lenses Really Better?

Do Engraved Numbers Tell The Truth?

Film Plane Illumination - How & Why?

Wide-Angle Wisdon

Telephoto Truths

Mirror Telephotos - Good & Bad News

Zooms: Pro & Con

Zoom Lens Image Quality

And other considerations

I suggest a reading especially in the first four posts.


PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 7:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The low contrast wide open gives a smoothing effect that can sometimes be quite nice. Here I had inadvertently thrown the A-M switch to A so the shot was wide open (exif says 35, but is was the 50).


PostPosted: Sun Mar 05, 2017 7:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@Lightshow: Yes, elements are clear when examined with flashlight.

@tb_a: Images that I provided are indeed pretty bright daylight, but it was shot from the inside of my room, so there was no any side light that would shine into the lens. When closing the aperture to f/2.0, this effect seems to be gone pretty much, or even closing it to about 1.8 (before the first click at 2.0).

@D1NO: I agree, bigger glasses definitely make imperfections less noticeable.

@Gardener: Yes, it had to be modded to achieve infinity focus on Nikon body. The mod was simply unscrewing the rear element for about a millimeter, and I have tested the lens before and after that "mod", and no significant changes occurred, nothing seems different at 100% crop examinations.
And like on your example, mine behaves almost the same, with CA on out of focus stuff.
I will read articles you provided, they seem pretty interesting just by scrolling through.

BTW, I don't know how much this lens is priced in other countries, but this one, I got for 30 Euros, along with Pentax Spotmatic SPII, because the man that sold it to me thought that lens' rear element was deeply scratched, but it was just a dirt inside of the rearmost element. Smile And normal price here in Serbia is around 80e for the lens.


PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 11:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

[quote="tb_a"]Although I have this lens already for several years I didn't realize that up to now as it would never come into my mind to use it fully open under such circumstances. The pictures are heavily overexposed even at aperture times of 1/4000 and have to be corrected afterwards anyway. So I normally would stop down to at least F5.6 for such purposes and then the lens is working excellent.

[/quote]

4x or 8x neutral density filter?


PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 12:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

folderholder wrote:
tb_a wrote:
Although I have this lens already for several years I didn't realize that up to now as it would never come into my mind to use it fully open under such circumstances. The pictures are heavily overexposed even at aperture times of 1/4000 and have to be corrected afterwards anyway. So I normally would stop down to at least F5.6 for such purposes and then the lens is working excellent.



4x or 8x neutral density filter?


The use of a ND filter does indeed avoid overexposing BUT the overall result, i.e. the "glowing" effect remains the same. As already stated, for such infinity landscape situations I would never use any fast lens fully open in order to gain maximum quality and better DOF. Stopping down to at least F5.6 is therefore recommended anyway under such circumstances.


PostPosted: Mon Mar 06, 2017 1:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

tb_a wrote:

The use of a ND filter does indeed avoid overexposing BUT the overall result, i.e. the "glowing" effect remains the same. As already stated, for such infinity landscape situations I would never use any fast lens fully open in order to gain maximum quality and better DOF. Stopping down to at least F5.6 is therefore recommended anyway under such circumstances.


Common sense Smile


PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 5:49 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Just for the sake of comparison - here are two images from the SMC Pentax 1.4/50
Taken at f1.4
T


#1


#2


PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 1:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yep, that's it, definitely all Takumars have that same glow more or less.


PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

AlexKV wrote:
Yep, that's it, definitely all Takumars have that same glow more or less.


But most of the photos are acceptable, in the sense that there is glow, but there also some sharpness and resolution. Yours, OTOH, looks outright bad wide open, at least in the sort of scene you used it in.


PostPosted: Tue Mar 07, 2017 4:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here is a comparison, but this is full image, not cropped, but lowered resolution:




Right now, I'm planing to make an "aperture reducer", to reduce the aperture to fixed f/1.8 or 2.0 and have the perfect circle instead of aperture leaves, for nicer bokeh. At f/1.4 with this kind of haze, for me is pretty unusable.


PostPosted: Wed Mar 08, 2017 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For a further comparison, here is a shot from the Super-Takumar 1.4/50
Taken at f1.4
T


#1