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Distagon C/Y 28mm f/2 vs SMC Pentax K 28mm f/2
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PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 2:34 pm    Post subject: Distagon C/Y 28mm f/2 vs SMC Pentax K 28mm f/2 Reply with quote
Same optics, as proven by my friend Marco Cavina, based on patent literature and documents of Dr Glatzel, Zeiss' chief designed at that time



PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 3:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Happy Cat


PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 3:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
the pentax is identique to zeiss "holywood" 28mm f2
http://forum.mflenses.com/poor-mans-zeiss-distagon-28mm-f-2-hollywood-t16851.html


PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 4:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
thebbm wrote:
the pentax is identique to zeiss "holywood" 28mm f2
http://forum.mflenses.com/poor-mans-zeiss-distagon-28mm-f-2-hollywood-t16851.html


exactly what I wrote... Wink


PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 7:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
kds315* wrote:
exactly what I wrote... Wink

Excatly Wink this lens is very rare, i never see it on the used local market


PostPosted: Fri Dec 30, 2016 10:50 pm    Post subject: Re: Distagon C/Y 28mm f/2 vs SMC Pentax K 28mm f/2 Reply with quote
kds315* wrote:
Same optics, as proven by my friend Marco Cavina, based on patent literature and documents of Dr Glatzel, Zeiss' chief designed at that time

Thanks, Klaus, for providing that graphic. Here's another one of Marco's images of the "Hollywood Twins", which combines the two lens diagrams, but also more clearly indicates the high-refractive glass elements.



[I am still in awe of the fact that fully two-thirds of the lens elements are ground from high refractive index glass -- this was quite a "deluxe" lens design.]

The above graphic was originally taken from an article in Italian by Marco Cavina -

SMC PENTAX 28mm f/2 : LA STORIA NON SCRITTA - http://www.marcocavina.com/articoli_fotografici/Pentax_28_2_M/00_pag.htm

And here's a Google machine translation of the above article into English (that works well enough) -

SMC PENTAX 28mm f/2 : HISTORY NOT [yet] WRITTEN - http://translate.google.com/translate?hl=en&sl=it&tl=en&u=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.marcocavina.com%2Farticoli_fotografici%2FPentax_28_2_M%2F00_pag.htm&sandbox=1

The article also indicates the relationship to the Pentax M 28/2 (which later became the A 28/2), which is NOT of the same lens design as the K 28/2.

[I should also point out that the current Zeiss Distagon 28/2 is also NOT the same lens as the original Distagon C/Y 28/2.]


PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 3:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Are you guys aware of any other famous designs from Zeiss or Leica that got copied?

Thanks!


PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 5:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
minolta make a zoom in cooperation with leica , the rokkor md 35-70mm f3.5 constant macro version (check the macro).
Leica sold it far expensive than minolta but same optic design


PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 8:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
andk wrote:
Are you guys aware of any other famous designs from Zeiss or Leica that got copied?

Thanks!


What I mentioned was a cooperation, not copying.

But engineers often "borrow" ideas for own designs Wink


(c) Marco Cavina


PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2017 9:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
kds315* wrote:

andk wrote:
Are you guys aware of any other famous designs from Zeiss or Leica that got copied? Thanks!

What I mentioned was a cooperation, not copying. But engineers often "borrow" ideas for own designs Wink

Yes. If you look carefully at the second paragraph of the article from Marco Cavina (links above), it's quite clear that it was a two-way cooperation (for a time).

BTW, if I'm reading Marco's words (at least the machine-translated-by-Google words) correctly, Zeiss had a hand in the design of the actual Pentax K-mount, as well as in the optics of the SMC K 28/2. Interesting...


PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2017 5:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have the K 28/2, wonderful lens.
andk wrote:
Are you guys aware of any other famous designs from Zeiss or Leica that got copied?

Thanks!

The Biotar 58/2 & 75/1.5 to copied by Helios 44 and 40 respectively.
And Minolta shared a few designs with Leica, 24/2.8, 35-70/3.4, and a few others.


PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
just out of curiosity if anyone knows: i recently bought the 'new' zeiss 28/2 in native zk (pentax) mount. is it the same optical formula as the contax 'hollywood'? it seems much more compact a lens than the original...

btw, ming thien called the new zk version the single best lens hes ever used.


PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2017 1:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
rbelyell wrote:
just out of curiosity if anyone knows: i recently bought the 'new' zeiss 28/2 in native zk (pentax) mount. is it the same optical formula as the contax 'hollywood'? it seems much more compact a lens than the original...

The Zeiss (Cosina) ZK 28/2 is "similar" to the two "Hollywood" lenses, but is not identical -



PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 4:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
andk wrote:
Are you guys aware of any other famous designs from Zeiss or Leica that got copied?

Thanks!


The Zeiss 3.5/15mm was originally developped by Zeiss, and later found its way into the Pentax lens line-up, although slightly modified. It was also produced in a Leica R mount, as Elmarit-R 3.5/15mm.

The Minolta lenses 3.5/35-70mm (MD-I), MC 4.5/80-200mm, MD 4.5/75-200mm, MC 2.8/24mm as well as the Reflex 8/500mm were produced also in a Leica R mount, in Japan by Minolta - for Leica. The later MD-III 3.5/35-70mm as well as the MD-III 70-210mm were co-developped by Minolta and Leitz.

The Sigma 3.5-4.5/28-70mm was produced also also as Leica R 3.5-4.5/28-70mm.

The Zeiss 1.4/55mm for Contarex was probably copied by Mamiya, but i've never seen a real proof for that.

The Leica-R Shift lenses 4/35mm and 2.8/28mm are Schneider designs.

The lens section of the Zeiss C/Y 4/80-200mm and the lens section of the famous Leica-R 2.8/70-180mm are very similar - which can be easily unterstood since both lenses were designed by Lothar Kölsch (he first worked at Zeiss, later at Leitz).

The Zeiss Batis 1.8/85mm has the same lens section as the Tamron 1.8/85mm, and i would bet that Tamron has the patents, not Zeiss.

These are just a few that come to my mind - but I'm sure there are other examples for cooperation between Leitz, Zeiss and other companies.

Stephan


PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
stevemark wrote:

andk wrote:
Are you guys aware of any other famous designs from Zeiss or Leica that got copied?

The Zeiss 3.5/15mm was originally developped by Zeiss, and later found its way into the Pentax lens line-up, although slightly modified.

Here are some details (some conjectural) of the relationship between the Zeiss and Pentax 15/3.5 lenses -
http://www.bdimitrov.de/kmp/lenses/primes/ultra-wide/K15f3.5-i.html

Last edited by fwcetus on Thu Jan 12, 2017 4:16 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Wed Jan 11, 2017 5:23 pm    Post subject: minolta 800RF Reply with quote
To the above list of Minolta optics for Leica R should be added the catadioptic 800mm which was also produced with the Leica R mount and had a brief listing in the official LeicaR optics table.

In contrast to the optics that Minolta produced on behalf of Leitz, this one just came out from the factory in Japan with the shorter R mount, but labelled "Minolta" rather than Leica.

A much more clearly advertised addition to the official list as well as to the brochures was the Angenieux zoom which also followed from an egreement with that factory. The two later Angenieux zooms with R-mount were not listed in the LeicaR lists.

p.
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