Best mirrorless FF camera body for MF lenses

[guardian]

My MF lens collection has grown to perhaps 200 lenses, plus or minus. I have my share of cats and dogs, a modest number of nice lenses, and a couple of very good lenses (Angenieux, Noritar). I've been thinking about possibly purchasing a FF camera body to use with all these lenses, since virtually all of my lenses were originally intended for FF (film) camera bodies. I want to buy a mirrorless FF camera body with:

*image stabilization since none of my lenses, all being older, has IS

*a mount type having many adapters available, to allow future purchase of a wider array of MF lenses (see note below)

*no camera body parts too close to the mount; with my current Sigma SD14 camera body, for example, some MF lenses protrude too far into the camera body so cannot be used. I want a camera body that will not limit my use of MF lenses.

*a through the lens viewfinder would be great

Can anyone suggest a mirrorless FF camera body that meets all those criteria?



Note:

For example, one of my Angenieux lenses has an Exakta mount. It would be foolish of me to buy a camera body having a mount for which no Exakta adapter is available.

[newst]

I can only recommend the Sony A7 Mk 2. It isn't perfect (no camera is) but it will accommodate the greatest range of lenses with IS and TTL focusing.

[meanwhile]

The obvious answer is one of the Sony a7 series, with the a7RII being the standout. 42MP, in-body stabilization, adapts almost anything ... but unfortunately it's not that simple.

What kind of lenses do you mainly shoot? Some wide, short flange lenses struggle on the Sony a7 series. Guessing budget isn't really an issue if you are shooting Sigma SDs.

[dan_]

Mirror less + FF + IBIS = Sony A7II & Sony A7IIR.
Sony A7II & A7RII are the only cameras meeting your requirements. Not many options, really.

[Lightshow]

For FF & Mirrorless, you have a few options, Leica M, & Sony A7/A7r/A7s/A7II/A7rII and Leica's new SL.
With IS, that short list gets reduced down to the Sony A7II & A7rII.
The A7 series is really one of the best options available for adaptability, and each new release has improved on the previous versions.
The biggest issue you will come across is the corner performance of Rangefinder wide angles lenses, Kolari is performing a thin lowpass filter replacement, it helps reduce corner smear and color shading/shift.
http://kolarivision.com/product/sony-a7-series-thin-filter-legacy-lens-upgrade/

[paulhofseth]

A long time ago I used the Kodak full-frame DSLR. About 14mp which at that time was about the best , very good colours but not good in low light and not that good for finding the right manual focus point. I found that a smaller sensor with larger pixel density would also allow cropping and big size prints and the more recent device gave less noise. The size of the camera also allowed it to accompany me more often. As for the number of pixels, with 300dpi, most bodies today allow A3prints, but a large pixelcount can to a certain extent substitute for a zoom lens.

At the moment I am using a Canon SLR (with the MFscreen) for "long mount" optics and its remote control abilty via the computer for tripod and bellows indoors. I use a tiny, internally stabilized Olympus for short manual optics. It also alllows the use of some excellent c-mount glass.

Both have their faults. Canon; too big for pockets and for Leitz M optics. Olympus, terrible touch-screen, moving the light metering spot and focus magnification area randomly when, inevitably, it is touched and no rear screen is good in strong light . Neither camera has a convenient method of forcing exposure time without faffing around with menus and squinting at screens. The Olympus stick-on electronic viewfinder works, and tilting it up is good for low-tripod-macro outdoors, but slightly defeats the purpose of having a small, pocketable camera and another pocket for extra optics.

I have looked at camera bodies with electronic VF built in (Sony, Fuji), but would also like to have internal stabilization, no battery eating WiFi & no rearscreen to get broken. Fuji has a shutter time wheel on some models, but is a bit big. Sonys big-sensor lives in a body that does not easily fit in a pocket.

Conclusion, for my part I will continue to use two different systems and wait until a better combination of features turns up and until some "features" go away.

p.

[meanwhile]

[Pontus]

The camera that suits your needs best is the Sony A7Sii, but only if you can live with a 12 MP sensor. This camera has a sensor that works well with many wide lenses that produce smearing and color shift with the other A7 family cameras. If you wish to save some money you could also buy the A7S which can be had for a lot less second hand. Both cameras use the same sensor but the A7S lacks image stabilization. The thing is, the A7S and the A7Sii are low light monsters and you can you higher ISO than with other cameras. Maybe the A7S is enough because of this, maybe you don't really need stabilization if you choose this camera.

If money is no object then I would choose the A7Rii with a native mount lens for the wide end and use legacy lenses for the longer focal lengths. Or buy an A7Sii for the wider lenses and a A7Rii for the longer ones.

[tb_a]

[memetph]

For me the A7x would be the best MF lenses cameras if the focus magnifier would need only one press and not three. I don't understand that Sony does not offer the choice in the menu.
A magnifier not occupying all the surface of the image would be nice too.

The new Panasonic GX8 seems to have a much more advanced ergonomy for manual focusing. So Sony, go back to work and and include that in a firmware if you care about your customers !

Why mirrorless do not offer also a focus confirmation based on spot contrast AF like DSLR with phase AF ? It would be not as accurate as the magnifier but far more quicker in some occasion. I don't like FP.

[guardian]

Guys I appreciate the many responses. Thank you.

There is a lot here for me to consider, and it's going to require time and study. My only observation at this point is surprise there are not more options. I have already waited a couple of years on this, while collecting MF lenses all along. I (wrongly) thought that by now more camera body manufacturers would be catering to MF lens aficionados, like us. That's probably naive. But I'm still disappointed.

BTW, a couple of responses raised the issue of cost. Money is, and is not, a factor. I don't object, in general, to paying the "going rate" for something I want. However, with there apparently being so little competition, one could surmise the "going rate" in future, if camera bodies from more manufacturers become available, might be less than it is today. I don't mind waiting somewhat longer, but I would enjoy having a camera body for all these lenses before I die.

[Lightshow]

[Lightshow]

[meanwhile]

[Lightshow]

[uhoh7]

Here's an extremely interesting benchtest of Sony Native lenses on Roger's optical bench:

http://www.lensrentals.com/blog/2015/10/sony-e-mount-lens-sharpness-bench-tests/comment-page-2#comment-100777

relating to this discussion:

"First, unlike most of the Canon and Nikon mount tests we've already done, we've added 2mm of optical glass to the testing path of these lenses. Why? Because we ran lots of trial tests and found that at least the first Sony lenses we tested performed much better with that amount of glass in the optical path. It made a big difference with the Sony lenses, while it did not make much difference for most of the Canon and Nikon lenses we tested."

Reverse this finding. What is "the glass in the path" on the body? What is it doing to our legacy lens performance?

Real vindication for a Kolari Mod I think.

I think IBIS is overrated and requires alot of fiddling with each lens to set properly on the Sony. It's ultimate sharpness potential is less than without. Adds bulk and complication to the camera. Pick an appropriate shutter speed and there is no need. Just my own take there.

What is the best legacy glass body? The Leica SL.

What is the best affordable solution? A7 (700USD) Kolari Mod (400) = 1100 USD.
With IBIS? A72 (1300) + Kolari (500) = 1800USD

PS Copy variation of modern zeiss lenses is not inspiring, note the graphs in the tests. Yikes.

[memetph]

Sony glass needs a 2mm glass to be better on Mr Cicala's bench. That is fine.
It does not have much influence on other brands. Great finding.

On my A7 I did not find that my legacy lenses suffer compared to my FE lenses. I am happy that my A7 is not modified.

Regarding the Leica SL, we shall see the reviews and feed backs. It is an expensive , big and heavy camera so it has to perform exceptionnaly to deserve a recommendation for legacy lenses.
Unfortunately it seems that they copied Sony .... The focus magnifier needs multiple press to be activated.
It is stupid when you know that Leica owners and fans have M lenses. Some of them expect finally a solution to get a reliable focusing to use their fast lenses on digital.

[meanwhile]

[tb_a]

[Lightshow]

[tb_a]

[meanwhile]

[tb_a]

[guardian]

FWIW, some of these most recent revelations are a little off-putting for someone like me who is less knowledgeable and sophisticated than many, and who has yet to purchase a FF digital camera body. Here in the USA we are going through the VW cheating scandal, where they messed with the computers in their cars to facilitate passing the emissions tests. It took quite a long while to discover VW's treachery.

So I'm wondering:

Are camera body manufacturers fooling with the computers in their camera bodies, or messing with their proprietary software, to enhance photographic results with their own (expensive) lenses while harming outcomes for those of us with a preference for (vintage or non-vintage) MF lenses? Obviously I dunno.

But let me tell you:

I still have several quite nice 35mm film camera bodies, every darn one of which is a FF camera body. And stuff like this is nearly enough to make MF lens users consider returning to film and eliminating the possibility of any such repugnant computer flim flam shenanigans!

[memetph]

Interesting discussion where we learn many new things !!
Native FE lens are made to work with Sony a7 serie sensors .
Some of those lenses are corrected by software.
Zeiss has an official cooperation with Sony.
Legacy SLR lenses works with the A7 ( there has been already serious tests made ). It is confirmed that there is almost no influence of this 2mm glass on SLR Nikon Canon lenses performance.
Uhoh7 likes Leica and finds ( or perhaps will find) the Leica SL the best camera for legacy lens.
Tb-a likes Ricoh
WV cheated everybody