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Fast 85mm range lens?
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PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 11:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
orly_andico, have you already looked at this option?

http://forum.mflenses.com/new-cheap-chinese-opteka-85-1-8-t62887,start,15.html#1442437


PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 3:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
There is a Vivitar brand 85mm f/1.8 Aspherical available new on eBay for about $100. MF only. The example photos look decent. See it here:

Click here to see on Ebay


PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 4:01 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
cooltouch wrote:
There is a Vivitar brand 85mm f/1.8 Aspherical available new on eBay for about $100. MF only. The example photos look decent. See it here:

Click here to see on Ebay

This is the same lens as the Opteka 85/1.8.


PostPosted: Sat Jul 04, 2015 5:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Pentacon six mount Biometar 80mm is a lovely creamy bokeh lens and still affordable.


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 5:36 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
calvin83 wrote:
cooltouch wrote:
There is a Vivitar brand 85mm f/1.8 Aspherical available new on eBay for about $100. MF only. The example photos look decent. See it here:

Click here to see on Ebay

This is the same lens as the Opteka 85/1.8.


Yeah, this is what I figured, and probably other brands too, like Rokinon. It is probably also not a very sturdy lens, and will require delicate handling just so it might last a while. But the images I saw at that auction and also on the web when I was googling it looked good, so it might be worth it as a cheap alternative.


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 6:04 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
1960s single coated CZJ Biometar 2.8/80 on Sony a850. Lens cost me 24ukp plus shipping from Norway.



Thomas insists these old eastern Zeiss are junk you shouldn't pay more than 5eu for from the flea market, but I can tell you that this Biometar has silky smooth focus and a perfectly functioning aperture and has never been serviced. Build quality and materials make the modern cheap alternatives look like cheap plastic toys. This Biometar is still going strong after half a century, it will serve me the rest of my life most likely, making it quite a bargain.


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 7:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
cooltouch wrote:
calvin83 wrote:
cooltouch wrote:
There is a Vivitar brand 85mm f/1.8 Aspherical available new on eBay for about $100. MF only. The example photos look decent. See it here:

Click here to see on Ebay

This is the same lens as the Opteka 85/1.8.


Yeah, this is what I figured, and probably other brands too, like Rokinon. It is probably also not a very sturdy lens, and will require delicate handling just so it might last a while. But the images I saw at that auction and also on the web when I was googling it looked good, so it might be worth it as a cheap alternative.

$99 is less than the price sold in China(it cost 650 RMB and the Mitakon 85/2 cost 850 RMB). It may be a good choice for those who use it occasionally but not for anyone who need a reliable work horse.

If you ask me, I would rather to get an old Nikkor 85 1.8/2 for ~$100-$120 in eBay from US/Japan if you can wait for a month or two.


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 8:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
cooltouch wrote:
calvin83 wrote:
cooltouch wrote:
There is a Vivitar brand 85mm f/1.8 Aspherical available new on eBay for about $100. MF only. The example photos look decent. See it here:

Click here to see on Ebay

This is the same lens as the Opteka 85/1.8.


Yeah, this is what I figured, and probably other brands too, like Rokinon. It is probably also not a very sturdy lens, and will require delicate handling just so it might last a while. But the images I saw at that auction and also on the web when I was googling it looked good, so it might be worth it as a cheap alternative.


Definitely NOT the Rokinon. The Rokinon is a re-branded Samyang. Korean, not Chinese, and a good quality, solid lens that performs well.


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 10:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:

Thomas insists these old eastern Zeiss are junk you shouldn't pay more than 5eu for from the flea market,


Why don't you stop to tell such nonsense?

Once again. Maybe even you are able to understand it sometimes correctly if I repeat it once more. I think all others have understood my message as it was meant:

I stated that according to my own experience the mechanical quality of those lenses is below W. German and Japanese standards and that some years ago you have been able to get those lenses for almost nothing on the fleamarkets in Austria and that this times are obviously gone. Especially the type of lubricant used can easily lead to stuck apertures or stuck focusing helicoids. I even read somewhere in a German forum that the likelihood that if such a lens is exposed to higher temperatures (typically when the lens is left behind in a parked car under direct sun light in summer) is rather high that the lubricant changes it's viscosity which was stated as one of the reasons for that typical problem. I don't know if that is really true but it sounds somehow logical to me. Almost all my GDR lenses suffer from that, although I barely leave my equipment in a parked car or heat it otherwise. I never bought any of those lenses new, so I am unfortunately not able to reconstruct the whole history of every lens I have.
On the other hand there are some people who don't have those problems. So it may be a matter of luck, or even any pre-owner had serviced the lens already and used a better lubricant or (if above theory is correct) the lens was never exposed to higher temperatures. I don't really know and it's not important for me as I won't pay more than a few bucks for such a lens, if at all. This attitude may change if I know for 100% that the lens was already serviced and I will get a kind of guarantee for that. Otherwise the risk to get another dead duck is simply too high for me and I prefer to use and not to repair or service lenses.
I never said anything negative about the optical quality, except for the Pentacon/Meyer 50/1.8 lens which I have from an old Praktica camera and this lens is objectively compared to any other lens I have in this class simply bad and unsharp. However, there are some bokeh lovers that like this lens for it's typical "failures" and if somebody want to produce some art like pictures this lens may have some strenghts. But that is purely a matter of taste and nothing else.
This reflects my personal experience over the last 40 years of photography.
Other people may have other experiences or opinions. I don't really care and I had never any problem if somebody else came for any reason to a different conclusion. Everybody is free to like or use whatever suits the personal preferences and of course everybody is free to pay whatever is considered to be appropriate for such a lens. So do I.

I also don't care what you are believing or not or if you like or dislike any lens for any reason. But I do care if somebody like you spreads lies around about things I've never said.

May I kindly ask you once more to stop your lies?
Thank you!


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 10:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
You need both a sense of humour and some humility. Jeez. Rolling Eyes


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Guys, pleeeeze, it is very hot, so please cool down!!!


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 2:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
calvin83 wrote:

If you ask me, I would rather to get an old Nikkor 85 1.8/2 for ~$100-$120 in eBay from US/Japan if you can wait for a month or two.


Yes, that would be my preference as well. It's hard to go wrong with any of the fast Nikkor 85mm's. Just a little FYI: $100-120 is very cheap here on US eBay for a Nikkor 85/1.8 or 85/2. Probably the only way to buy one that cheap here would be to participate in an auction. BINs are always quite a bit more, typically in the $190-220 range.

Also, I've bought several items from Japanese sellers on eBay. My experience with them, as far as shipping time is concerned, is that I'll often get the item inside of two weeks. Pretty prompt, considering the distance and having to go through Customs and all. Also, I've found that shipping prices can vary widely from one Japanese seller to another.


PostPosted: Sun Jul 05, 2015 2:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
cooltouch wrote:
calvin83 wrote:

If you ask me, I would rather to get an old Nikkor 85 1.8/2 for ~$100-$120 in eBay from US/Japan if you can wait for a month or two.


Yes, that would be my preference as well. It's hard to go wrong with any of the fast Nikkor 85mm's. Just a little FYI: $100-120 is very cheap here on US eBay for a Nikkor 85/1.8 or 85/2. Probably the only way to buy one that cheap here would be to participate in an auction. BINs are always quite a bit more, typically in the $190-220 range.

Also, I've bought several items from Japanese sellers on eBay. My experience with them, as far as shipping time is concerned, is that I'll often get the item inside of two weeks. Pretty prompt, considering the distance and having to go through Customs and all. Also, I've found that shipping prices can vary widely from one Japanese seller to another.

Yes. Most of the time one has participate in an auction to get it at that price. KEH will sell the Nikkor 85mm f/2 for $115 Click here to see on Ebay and Click here to see on Ebay. Sometimes, you may be able to get from KEH in better shape for the same price. Wink


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 10:39 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I really think that if you use a Canon body, that EF 85/1.8 is hard to beat for price, performance, usability (with AF, etc)

For very small (and thus portable), the Pentax M85/2 is nice.

20141012-DSC04223-1 by jenkwang, on Flickr
(can PF badly in very contrasty situations though)


J9 is like you said, nice, but prices have gone up.
Still a nice lens imo if you can find a good copy.

20150118-DSC08271-bw-2400 by jenkwang, on Flickr
Technically, not the strongest lens obviously (ie. flare resistance, sharpness ) , but nice Sonnar look


Pentax K85/1.9

Under the shade of solace by jenkwang, on Flickr
Very good imo.
Fast, sharp, less CA issues, decent size.


Takumar 85/1.9

20130524-IMG_0150Canon EOS 5D by jenkwang, on Flickr
Nothing bad to say about this lens too.
Easier to adapt on the Canon body and this shot was on a 5D.
Not much problems with this lens imo. (nice and reliable in most situations)


I don't think there is a wrong choice with 85mm lenses, like 50mm ones, they are mostly good.
Bokeh can fail in some situations and bkgnd types, bkgnd distances, but that applies for any other lens as well.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 10:51 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Anyone with any experiences with the Minolta 2/85 ?


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 11:53 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mir wrote:
Anyone with any experiences with the Minolta 2/85 ?


No. I have the 1.7 and 1.4 versions from Minolta.
However, you can see a quite interesting comparison also with the F2 version and some Zeiss lenses (Biotar and Sonnar) here:
http://artaphot.ch/sony-nex/altglas/325-nex-5n-und-portrait-objektive-mit-75-90mm-brennweite

In essence you can read there that the F2 version is also a very excellent lens which is already fully usable wide open, also on FF bodies.
However, as I have the other versions already it didn't make much sense for me to look additionally for the F2 version.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 12:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Very good photos, Jenkwang.

Just got a Nikkor K 1.8/85mm.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 12:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Jenkwang, thanks for the examples.
I too have the Takumar 85/1.9 and the Jupiter 9 among some others like the Minolta ones and can actually confirm what you are stating.
The likelihood to get a "dead duck" in the range of 85mm lenses is rather low.
Additionally in the field of 90mm lenses and if F2.8 isn't considered to be too slow there might be something available, which is rather good.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Stretch it to 90 and 2.5 there is the superb Tamron 52BB.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 4:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The Sigma 2.8/90 Macro has the smoothest most beautiful bokeh I have ever seen. Hard to find lens though, I have one for EOS and that can only be used on film cameras or wide open on digital EOS. I have been hunting for a Sony A mount one for a year or more, only seen one or two come up for sale and they were either expensive or had issues.

Wide open on my old EOS 405D, sadly the body of the butterfly is out of focus, but you get the idea about the bokeh, that was an extremely busy background of small colourful flowers and it has been rendered as an impressionistic swathe of colourful blobs.



Sadly it can only be used wide open on digial so the dof is always razor thin and the results always a bit dreamy but the smoothness is to die for imho.



On film where you can use it properly, it is bitingly sharp, this was at f4, supermarket scan from Agfa Vista Plus 200 C41 film.



PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 10:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The 85 mm is the FL of my dreams. I like almost all the lenses in this range.

Especially Nikkor, Rokkor, Canon, Zeiss.

I did not try the perspective of the 85 in my nex 5N. With FF it is known, but with the smaller sensor, not.

The J-9 is a great lens to me.

At 8/11 is very sharp, if you need the sharpness, there is.

At 2,8 can produce very nice portraits, as all of us know.

The price here is near the 300 bucks.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 06, 2015 11:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
papasito wrote:
The 85 mm is the FL of my dreams. I like almost all the lenses in this range.

Especially Nikkor, Rokkor, Canon, Zeiss.

I did not try the perspective of the 85 in my nex 5N. With FF it is known, but with the smaller sensor, not.

The J-9 is a great lens to me.

At 8/11 is very sharp, if you need the sharpness, there is.

At 2,8 can produce very nice portraits, as all of us know.

The price here is near the 300 bucks.


I too have a strong preference for the 85mm lens on a full frame camera. I have bought and sold several and now own:

Carl Zeiss (Oberkochen) Sonnar 2.8/85 in M42. (Zeiss made & branded Rollei lens)

Konica Hexanon 1.8/85

Jupiter 9 2.0/85 ( This is my third J-9. The first, a 1961 silver M39 model I bought on the cheap and got what I paid for. The second was a 1951 lens originally produced in Contax Rangefinder mount. It was modified by a prior owner to M42 mount and I am still playing with it to build a mount where it will focus to infinity. I just today received my third, a black, 1985, multi-coated lens in beautiful condition. I was lucky enough to hit on an Ebay sale by a photographer who was clearing out his M42 lenses and picked it up for $149.00 BIN. I have only had a few hours to play with it but I can now see why so many people love the J-9.)


PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 12:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I would like to add another vote for the Takumar 1.9/85
But your original suggestion of the Mamiya 2.8/80 is also very good and is a cheaper option.
OH
Super-Takumar 1.9/85



PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 12:42 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Oldhand wrote:
I would like to add another vote for the Takumar 1.9/85


Very nice example. I like the bokeh very much. Nothing to be nervous about. Wink


PostPosted: Tue Jul 07, 2015 1:47 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thank you Thomas.
I like the bokeh from the Takumar very much at wide apertures.
I do not have a sample from the Mamiya 1.9/80 at full aperture to show, but this one demonstrates its sharpness and colour rendition.
OH

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