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800mm or 1000mm vintage lenses for canon 5d mark II
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 7:49 pm    Post subject: 800mm or 1000mm vintage lenses for canon 5d mark II Reply with quote
Does anybody know what I should look for?

Vintage lenses for cheap money is most welcome Wink


PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 8:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
When you get up in that focal range, refractor lenses built for cameras become incredibly expensive. But there are alternatives that are much more affordable. Most of them are mirrors, though.

As for a cheap refractor, there are a few. Vivitar sold a preset lens back in the 60s or 70s that was a rear tube to which different heads could be attached -- 400mm, 600mm, 800mm. Back in the 90s, when I was a camera dealer, I sold several of these lenses. They sold for pretty cheap because they were regarded as being soft optically. I don't know because I never used the ones I had. But they seemed decently sharp when I looked through them with a camera mounted. So anyway, perhaps these Vivitars are still cheap today. I think they were made by Tokina, so you might also look for these big teles as Tokina lenses.

There's also another company that built excellent optics back around this same time frame. All the surf photographer used them. The ccompany was Century Precision Optics. They were acquired by Schneider a few years ago. So anyway, Century had two lines of telephotos -- one for the movie industry and one for still photographers. The Tele-Athenar lenses were for the movie people. The Tele-Athenar II lenses were for still photographers. The main difference between the two, far as I can tell, is the movie lenses' front optic rotated whereas the still lenses's front optic remained stationary. There were different lens formulations in each category as well, and it was generally considered that some of the movie formulations wouldn't work all that well for still photography. So anyway, the Tele Athenar II lenses were available in 500mm f/5.6, 650mm f/6.8, and 1000mm f/8 focal lengths and apertures. There may have been an 800mm but I don't recall offhand. The aperture irises were totally manual. These lenses aren't even presets. The 500mm and 650mm lenses are not all the difficult to use -- I own one of each -- they're reasonably lightweight. I've seen the 1000mm a few times. It is huge. A very stout tripod would probably be barely adequate for this behemoth.

Both Meade and Celestron have manufactured mirror lenses in the 1000mm range. They are tiny in comparison to the above Century. Typically these mirrors are f/8 or f/11 optics. Often they double as spotting scopes. You can often find them on eBay, selling in the $100-200 range. You would search for a Meade 1000mm or a Celestron C90. I've even owned once a Celestron C-8 spotting scope with camera adapter. It was a 1600mm f/8.

There are other scope makers whose optics, whether mirror or refractor, can be adopted for camera use for a small fraction of what you'd pay for the equivalent focal length in a camera lens. Even APO scopes can be a bargain, by comparison. And, by definition, an APO scope must have well-controlled chromatic aberration. Sorta like the equivalent of Nikon's ED and Canon's L. The drawback, of course, when using scopes as lenses -- well, actually there are two that come to mind immediately -- one, there is no aperture iris, so you're shooting wide open all the time -- same as a mirror lens -- and, two, closest focus may be twenty or thirty meters away and possibly even farther. Usually, if a scope is advertised as being able to do double duty as a lens, it will also have a tripod mount. Many scopes don't. They're designed to be strapped down to an equatorial mount, but typically these mount adapters can also be mounted to tripods.


PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
You might like to browse some "digiscoping" sites/blogs/threads. Digiscoping generally taken to mean photography with "spotting" scopes ie bird watching etc prismatic scopes rather than more specifically astronomical scopes that manufacturers like celestion, meade are known for.


PostPosted: Sun Jan 04, 2015 9:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
cooltouch wrote:
When you get up in that focal range, refractor lenses built for cameras become incredibly expensive. But there are alternatives that are much more affordable. Most of them are mirrors, though.

As for a cheap refractor, there are a few. Vivitar sold a preset lens back in the 60s or 70s that was a rear tube to which different heads could be attached -- 400mm, 600mm, 800mm. Back in the 90s, when I was a camera dealer, I sold several of these lenses. They sold for pretty cheap because they were regarded as being soft optically. I don't know because I never used the ones I had. But they seemed decently sharp when I looked through them with a camera mounted. So anyway, perhaps these Vivitars are still cheap today. I think they were made by Tokina, so you might also look for these big teles as Tokina lenses.

There's also another company that built excellent optics back around this same time frame. All the surf photographer used them. The ccompany was Century Precision Optics. They were acquired by Schneider a few years ago. So anyway, Century had two lines of telephotos -- one for the movie industry and one for still photographers. The Tele-Athenar lenses were for the movie people. The Tele-Athenar II lenses were for still photographers. The main difference between the two, far as I can tell, is the movie lenses' front optic rotated whereas the still lenses's front optic remained stationary. There were different lens formulations in each category as well, and it was generally considered that some of the movie formulations wouldn't work all that well for still photography. So anyway, the Tele Athenar II lenses were available in 500mm f/5.6, 650mm f/6.8, and 1000mm f/8 focal lengths and apertures. There may have been an 800mm but I don't recall offhand. The aperture irises were totally manual. These lenses aren't even presets. The 500mm and 650mm lenses are not all the difficult to use -- I own one of each -- they're reasonably lightweight. I've seen the 1000mm a few times. It is huge. A very stout tripod would probably be barely adequate for this behemoth.

Both Meade and Celestron have manufactured mirror lenses in the 1000mm range. They are tiny in comparison to the above Century. Typically these mirrors are f/8 or f/11 optics. Often they double as spotting scopes. You can often find them on eBay, selling in the $100-200 range. You would search for a Meade 1000mm or a Celestron C90. I've even owned once a Celestron C-8 spotting scope with camera adapter. It was a 1600mm f/8.

There are other scope makers whose optics, whether mirror or refractor, can be adopted for camera use for a small fraction of what you'd pay for the equivalent focal length in a camera lens. Even APO scopes can be a bargain, by comparison. And, by definition, an APO scope must have well-controlled chromatic aberration. Sorta like the equivalent of Nikon's ED and Canon's L. The drawback, of course, when using scopes as lenses -- well, actually there are two that come to mind immediately -- one, there is no aperture iris, so you're shooting wide open all the time -- same as a mirror lens -- and, two, closest focus may be twenty or thirty meters away and possibly even farther. Usually, if a scope is advertised as being able to do double duty as a lens, it will also have a tripod mount. Many scopes don't. They're designed to be strapped down to an equatorial mount, but typically these mount adapters can also be mounted to tripods.



Yet another excellent reply by Cooltouch.
If you were in the UK I would happily arrange a meet and gladly pick up the bar tab Mike. Thanks for your time and knowledge,even if I did not personaly start the thread.

Steve.


PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2015 7:28 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have a few mirror lenses - best being sigma 600/8 and MTO 500/8 - and a preset. 400/6.3 , that I use on nex and E-pm2.
I've even used 2X tc with the mirror lenses. A remote shutter control helps a lot.
It is not easy to use such a combo - vibration seems ever present and focusing accurately can be hard. None mirror lenses are long. . .

Well you can't cut through the haze if looking afar, whatever you use, but for me a relatively small superzoom compact is FAR more preferable.
I have SX50 canon with 1200mm optical , good stabilization and MF by button !
It fits in a jacket pocket. I use it daily.


PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2015 7:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I think Canon made a 1200mm f11 lens in fl mount, should imagine that it's a bit of a monster and you probably need a Llama to carry it!


PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2015 7:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Canon FD 800/5.6 L, $1500-1600 + $100 for conversion. Or Canon FD 500(600)/4.5 L $1000-1300 + $100 for conversion + your existing 1.4x teleconverter. Or Canon FD 400/2.8 L $1500+ + $100 for conversion + your existing 2x teleconverter. Or one of the older Nikkors 800/8, probably around $2000.


PostPosted: Tue Jan 06, 2015 11:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Mr G wrote:
I think Canon made a 1200mm f11 lens in fl mount, should imagine that it's a bit of a monster and you probably need a Llama to carry it!


Dunno about f/11 1200's in FL mount, but how about an EF 1200mm f/5.6? (I think Canon made a 1200mm in FD mount also):

http://www.bhphotovideo.com/find/newsLetter/Canon-EF-1200mm.jsp

Only 120k USD

(borrowed from Alex Wise Photography)


PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2015 12:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks guys for your awesome replies !

Cool


PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2015 1:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
How about the Tokina 800mm f.8?


Probably find them used for 2-400 Euro.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2015 1:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
OMG, that Canon is bigger than my 15 yr old son!,


PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2015 1:28 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
OMG, that Canon is bigger than my 15 yr old son!,


PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2015 3:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
keithcanisius wrote:
How about the Tokina 800mm f.8?


Probably find them used for 2-400 Euro.


Hey Keith, your Tokina is one of those 400, 600, 800 lenses I was referring to above. I was pretty sure the Vivitars I'd had were made by Tokina, but not certain after all these years. One of the giveaways is that aiming sight on the "head" of the lens. Your 800 should break apart in the middle. The ones I had actually came in a case where the head and the rear portion sat side by side. I'm assuming that, when new, the heads could be purchased separately.

Unless the landscape has changed quite a bit with these lenses, I'd say that the high side of your estimated price range is wishful thinking. About the most I could ever get for one back in the early 90s was a couple hundred bucks. I just took a look on US eBay. There's a guy in Canada who has two -- he's asking US269 and US299 for them. He's included sample photos. About what I expected. Noticeable red/green fringing, sharpness is just okay. There's someone else from Japan asking 400-something and lastly a guy from the US who's clueless -- asking US700.

Is the lens in your photo your lens? If so, what sort of image quality does yours deliver?


PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2015 7:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I had a 600mm f8 Soligor that had the gunsight and was Tokina made, bit of a beast s well and optically better than you would have expected.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 08, 2015 8:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
@Michael: it is mine. I tested this setup for few moon shots only. Frankly amateur tripod is unusable and shaking takes it's toll. Pentax Q crop factor makes this lens 4500mm Smile.
Nevertheless sharpness and contrast ware there. I promise to make new test soon.

The above combo went from T2 - Minolta MD - C-mount - Pentax Q. And yes it does disassembles in two parts for easier transport.
Also Vivitar branded serial starting with 17.

I think i made this shot with it. Quick try, clouds can be distinguished, dark to overcome shaking of tripod:


PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2015 3:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
That's actually a pretty good shot of the moon. I'm able to eke out a little more detail than that with my CPO 650mm f/6.8 on a reasonably stout tripod. The image still shakes like crazy when I touch the lens's focusing collar, so I end up taking several pics, focusing between each one, hoping that at least one will be close. My experiences so far have been they're almost all close. I think that's because I'm typically shooting with the lens stopped down to f/11.

I use my DSLR's Live View function for taking moon pics and the camera's self timer. That way the mirror's up and vibrations have usually settled down by the time the shutter fires. Plus it's firing at 1/125 @ ISO 100, which helps a little.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 09, 2015 3:35 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Edited

Last edited by bernhardas on Wed Jun 15, 2016 7:53 am; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 1:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
This was a 2000mm MF 6x6 telephoto lens Combo, and could only be focused over the LiveView function. The image of the Petersberg Hotel was done in a distance of 5.2 Km!



PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2015 6:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
cooltouch wrote:
When you get up in that focal range, refractor lenses built for cameras become incredibly expensive. But there are alternatives that are much more affordable. Most of them are mirrors, though.

As for a cheap refractor, there are a few. Vivitar sold a preset lens back in the 60s or 70s that was a rear tube to which different heads could be attached -- 400mm, 600mm, 800mm. Back in the 90s, when I was a camera dealer, I sold several of these lenses. They sold for pretty cheap because they were regarded as being soft optically. I don't know because I never used the ones I had. But they seemed decently sharp when I looked through them with a camera mounted. So anyway, perhaps these Vivitars are still cheap today. I think they were made by Tokina, so you might also look for these big teles as Tokina lenses.

There's also another company that built excellent optics back around this same time frame. All the surf photographer used them. The ccompany was Century Precision Optics. They were acquired by Schneider a few years ago. So anyway, Century had two lines of telephotos -- one for the movie industry and one for still photographers. The Tele-Athenar lenses were for the movie people. The Tele-Athenar II lenses were for still photographers. The main difference between the two, far as I can tell, is the movie lenses' front optic rotated whereas the still lenses's front optic remained stationary. There were different lens formulations in each category as well, and it was generally considered that some of the movie formulations wouldn't work all that well for still photography. So anyway, the Tele Athenar II lenses were available in 500mm f/5.6, 650mm f/6.8, and 1000mm f/8 focal lengths and apertures. There may have been an 800mm but I don't recall offhand. The aperture irises were totally manual. These lenses aren't even presets. The 500mm and 650mm lenses are not all the difficult to use -- I own one of each -- they're reasonably lightweight. I've seen the 1000mm a few times. It is huge. A very stout tripod would probably be barely adequate for this behemoth.

Both Meade and Celestron have manufactured mirror lenses in the 1000mm range. They are tiny in comparison to the above Century. Typically these mirrors are f/8 or f/11 optics. Often they double as spotting scopes. You can often find them on eBay, selling in the $100-200 range. You would search for a Meade 1000mm or a Celestron C90. I've even owned once a Celestron C-8 spotting scope with camera adapter. It was a 1600mm f/8.

There are other scope makers whose optics, whether mirror or refractor, can be adopted for camera use for a small fraction of what you'd pay for the equivalent focal length in a camera lens. Even APO scopes can be a bargain, by comparison. And, by definition, an APO scope must have well-controlled chromatic aberration. Sorta like the equivalent of Nikon's ED and Canon's L. The drawback, of course, when using scopes as lenses -- well, actually there are two that come to mind immediately -- one, there is no aperture iris, so you're shooting wide open all the time -- same as a mirror lens -- and, two, closest focus may be twenty or thirty meters away and possibly even farther. Usually, if a scope is advertised as being able to do double duty as a lens, it will also have a tripod mount. Many scopes don't. They're designed to be strapped down to an equatorial mount, but typically these mount adapters can also be mounted to tripods.


Excellent information, very informative Smile


PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 3:18 am    Post subject: just posted 800mm Reply with quote
Hi I saw your post and I don't know if your interested, but I just posted a Mamiya/Sekor ES 800mm f8 on marketplace, Mint all orig caps etc. Let me know and good luck!


PostPosted: Thu Dec 02, 2021 1:07 pm    Post subject: Re: just posted 800mm Reply with quote
Deephouse25 wrote:
Hi I saw your post and I don't know if your interested, but I just posted a ..................on marketplace,!


Thread from 2015.
Your post in Marketplace was removed.
Read the rules.
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