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Manual APS-C lenses
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PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 3:01 pm    Post subject: Manual APS-C lenses Reply with quote
Has any company made manual (that is: mechanical coupled) APS-C lenses?

I use a M4/3 camera and am enjoying the "half-frame" Olympus PEN-F lenses that I own. However I haven't been able to find any film era lenses from another company designed for something less than full frame.

Correct me if I am wrong, but APS-C cameras came about after lenses became auto focus without aperture rings, etc. So are there any mechanical lenses that were designed for APC-C that might be adapted?

Regards, C.


PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 3:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Dont know about any APS-C film lenses.

Here's assuming you don't yet know about the modern manual leses for APS-C by https://ttartisan.myshopify.com/collections/aps-c-lenses and https://7artisans.store/


PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 3:59 pm    Post subject: Re: Manual APS-C lenses Reply with quote
connloyalist wrote:
Has any company made manual (that is: mechanical coupled) APS-C lenses?

I use a M4/3 camera and am enjoying the "half-frame" Olympus PEN-F lenses that I own. However I haven't been able to find any film era lenses from another company designed for something less than full frame.

Correct me if I am wrong, but APS-C cameras came about after lenses became auto focus without aperture rings, etc. So are there any mechanical lenses that were designed for APC-C that might be adapted?

Regards, C.


I have a couple of APS film lenses (note these were never APS-C but covered all three APS formats - the choice between formats being one of the claimed advantages of APS) These minolta vectis lenses are highly electronic so as to be effectively useless, unless you buy a rare & expensive adapter. (I can't justify £300 for £20 worth of lenses).
FWIW I do also have some more modern digital APS C lenses which are totally manual (my APSC ultra wides all seem to fall into this class). Not what I'd call 'mechanically coupled' but using an aperture ring on the lens - the camera doesn't really need to know the aperture, it just does stop down metering.


PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 4:30 pm    Post subject: Re: Manual APS-C lenses Reply with quote
DConvert wrote:

I have a couple of APS film lenses (note these were never APS-C but covered all three APS formats - the choice between formats being one of the claimed advantages of APS) These minolta vectis lenses are highly electronic so as to be effectively useless, unless you buy a rare & expensive adapter. (I can't justify £300 for £20 worth of lenses).
FWIW I do also have some more modern digital APS C lenses which are totally manual (my APSC ultra wides all seem to fall into this class). Not what I'd call 'mechanically coupled' but using an aperture ring on the lens - the camera doesn't really need to know the aperture, it just does stop down metering.


To clarify, I am excluding screw drive AF lenses. In the strict sense of the word these are mechanically coupled and can be used with a "dumb" adapter, but in my view these were never really intended to be used as manual focus lenses. For one the focus ring is usually very narrow and second, without the screw mechanism on the camera the focus ring is tends to be quite loose (not to mention having a short throw; I prefer a long throw on my focusing ring).

DConvert, could you give me an example of one of the modern digital APS-C lenses you are thinking of?

By the way, best wishes to all! Smile

Regards, C.


PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 6:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
APS came way after autofocus, and by that time lenses were 35mm already.

A few makers still sell APS-C manual lenses, e.g.
https://www.samyanglens.com/en/product/product-srch.php?category=C
https://www.venuslens.net/product-tag/aps-c/


PostPosted: Sun Jan 01, 2023 8:38 pm    Post subject: Re: Manual APS-C lenses Reply with quote
connloyalist wrote:

DConvert, could you give me an example of one of the modern digital APS-C lenses you are thinking of?

Regards, C.


I was thinking of a 10mm/2.8 in Sony e-mount (doesn't cover FF) - I think mine was made by Samyang.
There are quite a few others, but I tend not to buy modern lenses. I manage to spend far to much on photography without buying new :0


PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2023 12:09 am    Post subject: Re: Manual APS-C lenses Reply with quote
connloyalist wrote:
Has any company made manual (that is: mechanical coupled) APS-C lenses?
...
Correct me if I am wrong, but APS-C cameras came about after lenses became auto focus without aperture rings, etc. So are there any mechanical lenses that were designed for APC-C that might be adapted?

Regards, C.


Konica Hexanon Zoom Lens 24x18 1:3.5 f=47-100mm

https://www.buhla.de/Foto/Konica/Objektive/e47-100_35.html

I have one of those rare beasts ... but I wouldn't recommend it for real photography;)

S


PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2023 1:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Pentax 110 lenses http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=69996

Nordentro wrote:
These are the two best lenses of the Pentax 110 lineup. They do well on m43 sensors with adapters with built in aperture. Wink

Here is mine:


PostPosted: Mon Jan 02, 2023 1:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
visualopsins wrote:
Pentax 110 lenses http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=69996

Nordentro wrote:
These are the two best lenses of the Pentax 110 lineup. They do well on m43 sensors with adapters with built in aperture. Wink


They do very well on MFT, but they were designed for 110 film which is smaller than APS which is the subject of the thread.
The 24mm does come very close to covering APS-c but the 18mm falls quite a long way short. The 50 will cover APS completely but doesn't IMO have the charm of it's smaller brothers

Last edited by DConvert on Fri Sep 01, 2023 3:49 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 4:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm thinking the Industar-69 28mm f/2.8 might (just) fit into this category.
It's from the USSR-made 'Chaika' camera, a half-frame 35mm camera with a 39mm thread interchangeable lens mount, though it's not exactly Leica/FED/Zorki etc. compatible and I'm unaware of any other lenses produced to fit.
I use one on my Samsung NX5 as a walkabout snapshotter with an f/8 and be there approach, fitted to an L39 adaptor … it doesn't focus to infinity with the aperture wide open, though can be modified, I believe, but for what I want it for it's quite adequate and very compact … just watch out for backlit subjects, it'll flare like crazy Wink


PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 5:24 pm    Post subject: full frame optics will serve on MFT Reply with quote
Apart from possible savings in weight and volume, full frame manual lenses will do as well on MFT as APS ones. There the choice of high quality mechanical focus and hand operated aperture optics is really large and if you really wish for tiny optics, some of the longer 16mm cine lenses will fill the MFT frame without vignetting. I have used a couple.

p.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:06 pm    Post subject: Re: full frame optics will serve on MFT Reply with quote
paulhofseth wrote:
Apart from possible savings in weight and volume, full frame manual lenses will do as well on MFT as APS ones. There the choice of high quality mechanical focus and hand operated aperture optics is really large and if you really wish for tiny optics, some of the longer 16mm cine lenses will fill the MFT frame without vignetting. I have used a couple.

p.


I've tended to use FF rangefinder lenses particularly LTM/L39 versions, when I want more compact optics.
They can be adapted to most mirrorless systems and can be quite small, certainly smaller than typical APS lenses Smile

c-mount lenses can be quite effective on MFT too, but resolution is often disappointing, as can be the coverage (lenses wider than 35mm may not cover the sensor)


PostPosted: Thu Jan 05, 2023 6:42 pm    Post subject: narrow film resolution Reply with quote
Lenses for 16mm will need substantially more resolution than those made for 35mm even considering that the brain compensates for unsharpness when watching movies. I recall using a 20something mm on MFT with good results. I do not have that one any longer so the exact data escapes me.

p.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
There are some 'wider' enlarger lenses that aren't designed to cover more than half frame, you could check out those. 35mm~ and below it seems.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 4:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
eggplant wrote:
There are some 'wider' enlarger lenses that aren't designed to cover more than half frame, you could check out those. 35mm~ and below it seems.


My 50mm/1.2 only just covers MFT.
Most of the shorter focal length ones I've seen are designed for 8mm cine and won't come close to covering MFT.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 5:12 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
DConvert wrote:
eggplant wrote:
There are some 'wider' enlarger lenses that aren't designed to cover more than half frame, you could check out those. 35mm~ and below it seems.


My 50mm/1.2 only just covers MFT.
Most of the shorter focal length ones I've seen are designed for 8mm cine and won't come close to covering MFT.


You're likely talking about projection lenses... not film enlarger lenses.

Here are some APS-C covering 'enlarger' lenses
https://www.closeuphotography.com/schneider-kreuznach-28mm-f2-8-componon-lens
https://www.closeuphotography.com/schneider-componon-35mm/2018/12/4/schneider-componon-35mm-f28-line-scan-lens-test


PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 5:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
8mm format lenses certainly do not fill the MFT frame, but some for 16mm do. The Kinoptic 20something i tried worked, as did the mount modified Schneider 50/0,95 but Angenieux zooms mostly vignetted.

p.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
eggplant wrote:
DConvert wrote:
eggplant wrote:
There are some 'wider' enlarger lenses that aren't designed to cover more than half frame, you could check out those. 35mm~ and below it seems.


My 50mm/1.2 only just covers MFT.
Most of the shorter focal length ones I've seen are designed for 8mm cine and won't come close to covering MFT.


You're likely talking about projection lenses... not film enlarger lenses.



Indeed you're right! I should have read your post more carefully. Embarassed


PostPosted: Fri Jan 06, 2023 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Also- noone has mentioned yet- a speedbooster/focal reducer is going to give you the most vintage, manual focus options without the crop factor / limited shallow DOF.

Recall that speedbooster adapters are physically shorter than their empty tube counterparts due to how the optics work (this is noted in the original white paper), and compare to the Pen F adapter - they are close in size.





Note the 20mm flange distance of MFT makes the speedbooster appear smaller *relative* to speedboosters for other mirrorless mounts, but I'm not sure that means too much.


PostPosted: Sun Jan 08, 2023 2:19 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Of course, classic 35mm cinema camera lenses all cover APS-C, since it's (more or less) 18x24mm. However, they are expensive!


PostPosted: Mon Jan 09, 2023 10:56 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
if someone interested i have pentax 110 70mm 2.8 lens,

hardly ever used / like new .. i might be selling it


PostPosted: Tue Jan 10, 2023 11:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks for the suggestions.

Last edited by CharlesLogan on Fri Mar 22, 2024 12:38 pm; edited 3 times in total


PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2023 7:46 pm    Post subject: Re: Manual APS-C lenses Reply with quote
connloyalist wrote:
Has any company made manual (that is: mechanical coupled) APS-C lenses?


I don't know whether it's exactly what you're looking for, but the TTArtisan 50mm 1.2 APS-C lens is excellent - and brand new it's only about 100 USD.

The ZY 35mm Speedmaster 0.95 Mk.II is another excellent APS-C lens.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 12, 2023 9:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
eggplant wrote:
Also- noone has mentioned yet- a speedbooster/focal reducer is going to give you the most vintage, manual focus options without the crop factor / limited shallow DOF.

Recall that speedbooster adapters are physically shorter than their empty tube counterparts due to how the optics work (this is noted in the original white paper), and compare to the Pen F adapter - they are close in size.

Note the 20mm flange distance of MFT makes the speedbooster appear smaller *relative* to speedboosters for other mirrorless mounts, but I'm not sure that means too much.


Some time ago I bought a focal reducer / speed booster as an experiment. This was (is) a Viltrox in Nikon F mount. I haven't used it for a while so I am going on memory here, but my impression was that it really degrades image quality. So I didn't pursue that. Perhaps a Metabones is better, I don't know, but certainly a lot more expensive and a little difficult to find in anything except Canon EF. Around 500 euro for the Nikon F or Leica R. The Canon EF goes for over 800 euros. That's a bit steep for me. The place I usually shop for such things lists the three mentioned but only stocks the Canon EF version.

Regards, C.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 13, 2023 12:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
My Metabones speedbooster ultra hasn't degraded IQ at all, and friends I know haven't found the Viltrox to turn their lenses into lemons.

You can adapt Nikon F and Leica R to Canon EF.

I have no idea where that 800 euro figure comes from except new and overpriced at that.

Prices of a 0.64x for MFT are very variable, as low as £105, to £186 and £220. The £105 one was mint in box.

I got my Ultra for APS-C for £140 in box.
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