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Artistic lens, Carl Zeiss Jena Biotar 58/2 ??
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PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 11:58 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The 44-2 preset version is my favourite ! Great build quality, smooth bokeh and great tones and flare !
If you want a contrasty sharp lens go for the more modern 44M-7 !

I shoot mostly film with the Helios !

Helios 44-2 with extra oily blades and Fuji Superia expired in 2005 :





PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have a nex-f3 and I am even happier to hear that people still shoot with film!!!


PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 1:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

okay I can't help you . I have A7 and micro 4/3. My helios are poor lenses with the A7 and very good teles with the Panas.


PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

why you said that they are poor with A7?

Is a lens camera specific?


PostPosted: Thu Mar 20, 2014 8:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I can speak only about my samples , a 44-2 and a 44 M6.
On A7 they are really poor in the corners ans borders ( sharpness).
They are subject to flare. The performance is bad with side light. Due to size of the sensor the problem is disturbing. I could not notice this problem with a smaller sensor ( G3) because it is cropped.
The last and the worst: many lenses have a gohsting issue with the A7. When stopped down, you can see a reflection of the aperture diaphragm on the image. It is certainly an interaction between the sensor and internal reflections in the lens when you face a source of light.
My 44m6 suffers strongly from this. I did not test the 44-2 in this situation.

Probably you will not have those problems with a NEX APS -C.
The 44 M6 is supposed to be sharper than the 44-2. In reallity , I would go for the last one because it is not that obvious in the center .


PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 8:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi
one more questions.
what about the 44-4? I think that was the lens my old Zenit 122 had. I was thinking it might be fun to use exactly the same lens.

Alex


PostPosted: Sun Mar 23, 2014 9:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

yep pretty much.


PostPosted: Tue Mar 25, 2014 8:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi there again.
After searching a bit more I have also found this lens

http://www.flickriver.com/photos/tags/domiron/interesting/

would you consider this one also as an artistic lens?

Regards
Alex


PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 9:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I have 2 Helios lenses the 44 (£20) and the 44-2(£12).

I am a bokeh addict and was blown away when i found out about these lenses.


A shot with the 44 on a Nikon D600 without infinity glass

44 without infinity glass



44-2 with infinity glass, shooting into the sun


44-2 not sure on Fstop.

44-2 @f/2 under exposed


PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 10:31 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

alaios wrote:
Hi there again.
After searching a bit more I have also found this lens

http://www.flickriver.com/photos/tags/domiron/interesting/

would you consider this one also as an artistic lens?

Regards
Alex

I would like one to find out how artistic it is but it is hard to come by, The helios would be the cheaper option.


PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 4:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

What is "infinity glass"?


PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 6:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi I keep googling a bit
and I also found a big collection of images from this guy

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.534546843265511.1073742080.478790495507813&type=3

can someone comment if he is photshoping like crazy? From me all these lenses would fall in the artistic category.

Regards
Alex


PostPosted: Thu Mar 27, 2014 7:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think he might be talking about the normal adaptors for Nikon that have the glass element in so you can achieve infinity focus, you can remove the glass as it degrades image quality in most cases a use the lens for macro work.

alaois, that's the domiron another members has mentioned on a different thread, from what read about it today it has interesting qualities and from those pictures I would have to agree!! no idea regarding how much work would be done on the images though.


PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 12:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

alaios wrote:
Hi there again.
After searching a bit more I have also found this lens

http://www.flickriver.com/photos/tags/domiron/interesting/

would you consider this one also as an artistic lens?

Regards
Alex


alaios wrote:
Hi I keep googling a bit
and I also found a big collection of images from this guy

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.534546843265511.1073742080.478790495507813&type=3

can someone comment if he is photshoping like crazy? From me all these lenses would fall in the artistic category.

Regards
Alex


No he's not photoshopping like crazy. You can't photoshop that bokeh stuff, or at least it would be extremly hard. It needs a little post processing (for example in Lightroom) to get anything out of it and I would say most sample on flickr have some slight PP like slight contrast boost, slight color saturation boost etc.. The Meyer Domiron 50/2 has even more funky in bokeh as the Helios 44 but is generally much more expensive. I have one since a few weels and it makes a lot of fun to use (I do highly prefer it over the Helios 44).

Here's a Domiron sample from last weekend with Sony A7 (FF), altered colors and cropped


Other lenses with funky/artsy bokeh are Meyer Trioplan 100/2.8, Helios 40-2 85/1.5, Jupiter-3 50/1.5, Fujian 35/1.7 for example.

Kram wrote:
What is "infinity glass"?

An element that extends flange distance so that you can adapt lenses with shoter flange distance to you camera and still reach infinity when focusing. For example M42 to Nikon adapters or Minolta MD to Sony A etc.
Basically they are 1.1x-1.3x-Teleconverters, made from crappy singlets in most cases.
I've never seen a good one.

memetph wrote:
I can speak only about my samples , a 44-2 and a 44 M6.
On A7 they are really poor in the corners ans borders ( sharpness).
They are subject to flare. The performance is bad with side light. Due to size of the sensor the problem is disturbing. I could not notice this problem with a smaller sensor ( G3) because it is cropped.
The last and the worst: many lenses have a gohsting issue with the A7. When stopped down, you can see a reflection of the aperture diaphragm on the image. It is certainly an interaction between the sensor and internal reflections in the lens when you face a source of light.
My 44m6 suffers strongly from this. I did not test the 44-2 in this situation.

Probably you will not have those problems with a NEX APS -C.
The 44 M6 is supposed to be sharper than the 44-2. In reallity , I would go for the last one because it is not that obvious in the center .

+1
Many of my 50mm lenses became somewhat poorer on A7 at wide apertures, even some with very good reputation like Minolta MD 50/1.4. FF-sensors are somewhat more demanding than 1.5x crop and 2x crop, as they are not cropping the "sweet spot". I think Helios 44-2 looks best on 1.5x-1.6x crop like from NEX or most consumer DSLRs from Canon, Sony etc.
That's why I'm currently thinking about buying Sony A6000 as second body, for when I need larger DOF, for tele, or when I need to crop the sweet spot with some lenses.

Maybe the Helios 44-M7/M6 is better on A7. As said I noticed that my 44-M7 had much sharper corners already on 1.5x APS-C than the 44-2 while my 44-2 was slightly sharper in the center.
So for crop sensors I would recommend the 44-2, but for FF the M7 etc. might be the better choice


Last edited by ForenSeil on Sat Mar 29, 2014 12:38 am; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 8:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi
I am also sharing with the community this link of the same facebook guy

https://www.facebook.com/media/set/?set=a.534546843265511.1073742080.478790495507813&type=3

where lenses are sorted and more artistic lenses are there. I am not sure though about costs and availability.

Regards
Alex


PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 8:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

ForenSeil,lucky you having a Domiron they were only produced for a short time.


PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 11:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

There is one on ebay and costs over 1000$
good luck Razz


PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 11:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lenses are instruments made of glass, metal and plastic: Photographers who can use their various characteristics to produce beautiful images are "artistic". Smile


PostPosted: Fri Mar 28, 2014 10:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

alaios wrote:
There is one on ebay and costs over 1000$
good luck Razz


Laughing I have patience and will wait for one to fall in my price range,sure it may take a few years but I will find one.


PostPosted: Sun Apr 06, 2014 3:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

memetph wrote:
okay I can't help you . I have A7 and micro 4/3. My helios are poor lenses with the A7 and very good teles with the Panas.

Last week I took my Panas with me for a trip to Costa Rica. The Helios 44-2 is really a nice tele for micro 4/3 cameras.






PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 7:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

For the price, I think the Helios44 is good fun.

DSC0632420140411ILCE-7-1 by jenkwang, on Flickr

I think there is a learning curve to using it on FF vs aps-c.
On aps-c, most of the mainly 'consistent' sharp portion of the lens is within the compositional area of the frame.
On FF, the usual compositional area (eg. rules of thirds area) is already affected by the swirl and loss of IQ when used wide open.
So there is a need to compose with the sharp areas of the frame.


PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 11:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mo wrote:
alaios wrote:
Hi there again.
After searching a bit more I have also found this lens

http://www.flickriver.com/photos/tags/domiron/interesting/

would you consider this one also as an artistic lens?

Regards
Alex

I would like one to find out how artistic it is but it is hard to come by, The helios would be the cheaper option.


I can strongly recommend the Domiron.
I love that lens.
Guess it was produced only for a short time because it declassed the Zeiss lenses.
This thread made me going into our garden to make a few fast non-artistic shots with my M42 Domiron on my Canon 5DII. Only cropped.




Hope to make some more next week, as I was asked to shoot some portraits.

Klaus


Last edited by exaklaus on Sun Apr 13, 2014 6:34 am; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Sat Apr 12, 2014 11:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Klaus,thanks for posting these,Simply Stunning.
I have only seen one Exakta Domiron on Australian ebay and the price was a little high...$200+.Thanks for confirming that there are M42 versions out their. Cool


PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 5:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

mo wrote:
Klaus,thanks for posting these,Simply Stunning.
I have only seen one Exakta Domiron on Australian ebay and the price was a little high...$200+.Thanks for confirming that there are M42 versions out their. Cool


Well, not really, I'm afraid, it is a prototype lens.....

Klaus


PostPosted: Sun Apr 13, 2014 6:33 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Crying or Very sad Crying or Very sad Oh well,I was hopeful for a few hours. Very Happy