Agnar vs Apotar lens on Agfa Isolette

[luisalegria]

I found a description of resetting infinity on an Agfa Apotar lens online. It looks like this lens has a single element in the focusing cell, with another separate fixed non-rotating element behind it in front of the diaphragm.

The cheaper version of the Apotar was the Agnar.

I have an Agfa Isolette with the Agnar, also a three element lens. Does anyone know if the front cell of the Agnar has two elements, and should there be a fixed element in front of the diaphragm ?

[Nesster]

The closest I could find:
http://www.appcott.co.uk/VINTAGE6X6/AGFA/ISOLETTE_AGNAR/ISOLETTE-AGNAR.htm

and rumor/innuendo that the agnar is really similar to apotar only slower and named different for marketing purposes...

[luisalegria]

Thank you !

So my problem may be that this darn camera may be missing the second element entirely !

[Nesster]

Yes, my memory isn't what it once was, but as far as I can trust it, every triplet I've seen has an element behind the front focusing lens. The shutter and diaphragm sit between second and third.

[Katastrofo]

I have this vision of Luis trekking through the jungles of Borneo, searching for the Second Element. Luis, I have four Isolette
I's if you want one. I got them from Certo6 and are very clean, but I
haven't tried any of them yet. I could check one out for bellows leaks and
send it to you, comes with a clean Agnar lens.

The Agnar and Apotar, stopped-down to f8 are so close in performance
you couldn't tell one from the other. This is what I've heard from several
people.

[luisalegria]

Nope, don't want to trek through Borneo. I come from those parts and, rather like Scarlett O'Hara, after fetching up in San Francisco I declared "As God is my witness, I shall never sweat again !"

My Speedex is quite clean and nice, if its the lens thats a goner then I am going to be quite sad about it.

I may indeed be in the market for one of your Isolettes, I'll work on this one some more but I may shortly make you an offer, and thank you very much !

I am also working on a truly abused Franka Rollfix 4.5x6 with a very nice Schneider Radionar/Prontor II. I got the bent cover straightened out through methods more suited to a blacksmith than a camera technician. The shutter is now firing nicely. The bellows are just excellent, strangely enough. Just have to clean the lens/set infinity and she should be working. Next step, if she does work out, is re-covering with a nice leather, the old stuff is hopeless.

[Katastrofo]

Luis, let me know how you fare on the lens. No money, please! Furs, pelts, and beads are just fine! (Hope noone from PETA is here..lol)

Here's a couple more I worked up from the Portra 160VC roll and I'm
sure once you get an Isolette running will knock these to the curb:

[Xpres]

That'll be it then!
There are indeed meant to be three parts. I have a disassembled Agnar - all three parts - from a broken shutter. You're welcome to it if you like.

[luisalegria]

Hmm,

In the lens line, if there is something in particular you are looking for, let me know. I have some curiosities.

Fur and feathers would seem to be out, the cats being very selfish about theirs, ungrateful wretches that they are.

Beads are possible, the wife and daughter are big on those.

Anything your women would want ?

[luisalegria]

Hi Xpres,

Very interesting suggestion ! I would indeed like to be able to get this one camera up to snuff. Thats an 85mm f/4.5 Agnar ? Let me know what you want for it.

[Seele]

Just for the benefits of others, allow me to describe how I set distance scale on folders.

Most folders with triplet lenses in leaf shutters are with front cell focussing, with the iris and shutter blades between the middle and rear groups. In that sense, there are two fixed groups, one on each side of the shutter, and the front group in a cell which screws and unscrews, varying its distance from the middle group to effect focussing.

With all the glass surfaces cleaned, I put the rear and middle groups into the shutter, then screw in the front cell. When I can, I use a collimator to establish the exact position of the front cell for infinity, and leave it there.

Very gingerly, I slip the focussing ring over the front cell and position it at the infinty setting, and then gently tighten the grub screws so as lock it to the front cell. After this I check infinity again, and if I was careful enough the focussing scale would be correct. All done.

[Xpres]

[luisalegria]

Hi Xpres,

Thanks again for the offer, but it turns out I had the second element all along - stuck hard to the first element, drat. I will make do with mine I'm sure.

[Xpres]

Ok.

[luisalegria]

Hi Xpres,

It seems I have ruined the second element (cracked) while trying to get the focusing mount on this thing to work. I must have distorted the lens cell while unscrewing it.

So I will be very grateful for your Agnar lens if you still have it available.

Please let me know what you want for it.

[Xpres]

Easily done though. I once took a pipe wrench to a particularly stubborn lens with predictable results.
PM your details and I'll pop it in the post.
I'll stick up a photo of it later just to make sure it's the one you need.

[Xpres]

It's been in the box of bits for some time without a home so is looking forward to a new lease of life if it fits the bill.

[luisalegria]

That looks like it, or close enough. What shutter was it in ?

[Xpres]

Gosh, I can't remember. Maybe a Vario. I trashed - or was unable to fix up - a couple of shutters before I worked out what to do and didn't keep the bits.

[luisalegria]

Thank you again for your very kind contribution towards getting an old beauty back in service !

[Xpres]

A pleasure Luis. It's on the way.

[luisalegria]

Thank you ! Thank you !

I just got it, cleaned off the green grease, and popped it in. It fits precisely in the shutter. The front element turns smoothly with a bit of new grease. I can see with wax paper, focus+infinity gives sharp and accurate results.

I'll get some film in it and lets see how it goes.

Thanks again, you have restored a real beauty. This must be a unique camera now, a real "Speedex-Isolette".

[Schnauzer]

I have found this whole thread most interesting. I'm waiting for photos now.
Pretty nice chaps here.

[Xpres]

I'm pleased it fitted... Looking forward to seeing some of those snaps!