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Taylor Hobson bargain?
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PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 12:19 am    Post subject: Taylor Hobson bargain? Reply with quote
Not sure if I got a bargain on this one or not. Could be a piece of junk, or a Cooke Taylor Hobson Amotal 2in f/2. The bidding started at $10 for the lot. I went in at $75 with 10 or so hours left and the proxy bid jumped instantly to $63US - and that's were it ended this afternoon. If it is an Amotal in decent shape I should be ok. Not sure if the mount has an effect on price. Originally they were made for Bell & Howell Photons, but when that camera failed to sell ($700 US in the late 40s!!!!!) many of the unsold Amotals were converted to LTM and a few to M42. So, could be a bargain, or could be a "pig in poke." Anyone on here have/use one?

Here are pics from the auction. The description referred to it as an "antique 8mm lens".





PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 7:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
It is an Amotal 2 inch F2, probably in original LTM mount. If you don't want it, I am happy to take it from you for what you paid. Wink


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 7:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nice find.
.......... and your 35mm bulk film loader is missing its handle. It is black bakelite body but the handle is brass with a red bakelite knob.
You do have to remember to count the turns of the knob to accurately judge frames loaded.
OH


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Wow, that's a price!!!!!
Sold a few during the years for several hundreds!

Klaus


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 9:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
It could be off a cine camera if it is referred to as '8mm lens'.


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 9:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Click here to see on Ebay

Guess it is sm39

Klaus


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 11:29 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
calvin83 wrote:
It is an Amotal 2 inch F2, probably in original LTM mount. If you don't want it, I am happy to take it from you for what you paid. Wink



Thanks, Calvin - I am am looking forward to giving a try on the Nex and see if it lives up to its reputation, if not, we'll see! Wink Wink


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Oldhand wrote:
Nice find.
.......... and your 35mm bulk film loader is missing its handle. It is black bakelite body but the handle is brass with a red bakelite knob.
You do have to remember to count the turns of the knob to accurately judge frames loaded.
OH


Thanks, Oldhand! I haven't shot film in quite a while - my old darkroom is kind of mess right now. Thanks for the tip on the film loader - I think it is a Lloyd. i used to use a Watson - kind of plasticky, but it did have a fairly reliable exposure counter!

Paul


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
philslizzy wrote:
It could be off a cine camera if it is referred to as '8mm lens'.


Hi Phils - could be, but I think that was a mistake in the listing - I am pretty sure the lens is an Amatol for 35mm still photography - just the size of the lens cap is a big hint.

P.


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 11:41 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
exaklaus wrote:
Click here to see on Ebay

Guess it is sm39

Klaus


Thanks for the link, Klaus. I am thinking that as well. From what I understand the original lenses were made by RTH for Bell & Howell for their Photon camera. When these failed to sell, the lenses were shipped to Italy to be re-mounted in LTM. This is why on the bottom of the LTM / sm39 varieties you often see "made in Italy" inscribed. I have no idea what the original Photon mount was like, or if RTH made this lens in LTM straight from the factory.

Paul


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 1:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I look forward to seeing some pictures from the lens.
Congrats.


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
The lens has a focusing mechanism, the original Foton ones didn't - like the Contax and Nikon and indeed Kiev, the focusing mechanism was on the camera body. The apertures are in f stops, the original Foton lenses used T stops (it was Bell & Howell remember). So yes it is probably converted to Leica screw. So quite useable - unlike an original Foton lens which would need an adapter made from a broken Foton body.


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 9:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Wow, that`s a bargain! Congratz! Very Happy


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 9:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Nice lens spotting and bidding ,look forward to seeing your samples from this lens.


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 10:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
philslizzy wrote:
The lens has a focusing mechanism, the original Foton ones didn't - like the Contax and Nikon and indeed Kiev, the focusing mechanism was on the camera body. The apertures are in f stops, the original Foton lenses used T stops (it was Bell & Howell remember). So yes it is probably converted to Leica screw. So quite useable - unlike an original Foton lens which would need an adapter made from a broken Foton body.


Thanks, Phils -encouraging news! The Foton looks like it was a nice camera - too bad it went the way of the Ektra. The story of American-made 35mm interchangeable lens cameras is a sad tale of wrong time, wrong place, or bad marketing, or engineering near misses, or poor management, etc. etc.

Paul


PostPosted: Thu Jul 31, 2014 10:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
mo wrote:
Nice lens spotting and bidding ,look forward to seeing your samples from this lens.


I think it was the lens cap that was the tip off!


PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 2:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
You knew what to look out for and that makes the difference, between missing a bargain or buying a bargain. Cool I am still learning Laughing


PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 10:01 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
mo wrote:
You knew what to look out for and that makes the difference, between missing a bargain or buying a bargain. Cool I am still learning Laughing


I'm watching a similar 'bargain' at the moment and have put in a highish bid. I hope I'm not disappointed if I win.

When you are buying a collection of old stuff like this you are taking a chance, mostly it has worked out fine for me, once in a while the thing I am looking at in the collection ends up in the bin. C'est la vie


PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 10:15 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have done well so far, but usually have to pay to get the lens fixed or at least cleaned. I am also watching a "risk" at the moment, a single lens described as parts or not working...I have set my limit and we shall see. Very Happy You have to be willing to take the risk don't you? before you get some of these "bargains".


PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 1:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
mo wrote:
I have done well so far, but usually have to pay to get the lens fixed or at least cleaned. I am also watching a "risk" at the moment, a single lens described as parts or not working...I have set my limit and we shall see. Very Happy You have to be willing to take the risk don't you? before you get some of these "bargains".


Aboslutely - it's always a risk, but if you are persistant and you have patience it can pay off. You can also mitigate your risk if you always assume that you will have to do at least a CLA on any used lens and build the cost or effort of that into the price - and then bid accordingly. Also if you have the will and the time, you can go for purchasing the mundane stuff your have no interest in and make a marginal, but consistant revenue on items that you know you will always be able to sell for a small profit. This way you can offset somewhat the cost of the losses.

My problem is that I too often develop an emotional connection with this stuff and can't bear to part with it! Embarassed

Paul


PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 2:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Look on the bright side, pity those females that are addicted to purchasing overpriced handbags!!


PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 3:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
You got a great bargain Paul, well done! Smile

Why are these lenses so valuable? For someone to pay up to £800 for a 2" (50mm] f2.0 doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Is it really
such a fantastic lens, or just a rare collector's item?


PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
peterqd wrote:
You got a great bargain Paul, well done! Smile

Why are these lenses so valuable? For someone to pay up to £800 for a 2" (50mm] f2.0 doesn't make a lot of sense to me. Is it really
such a fantastic lens, or just a rare collector's item?


From a user perspective, I would think that at best, it is comparable to the best 50mm f/2's of its time by Leitz or Zeiss or Voitlander. I am not aware of any evidence which would indicate it had any kind of new or cutting edge technology (glass type, optical formula, special coating, etc.) that would make it stand out from a user perspective. From the collector point of view, there has always been something mystical or apochraphal about the B&H Foton. Similar to the mystique that surrounds such cameras as the Kodak Super 620 or the Kodak Ektra - at least in the US. It might have something to do with "the camera system that never was" or the "camera system that might have been". Also these cameras demanded such a high price, many people admired them in magazines, but never saw them in the flesh, let alone could afford them. Perhaps that nostalgic dream is part of some camera collector genetic memory! LOL . The Cooke Taylor Hobson marque carries a cache as well, and there is extra rarity associated with a really high quality, precision camera/lens that originated in the US.

Any other speculations?

P.


PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 8:06 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Thanks. I'm looking forward to seeing some pics with it when you're ready.


PostPosted: Fri Aug 01, 2014 10:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Wise words,I am just starting to part with some of my early learning lenses (some call them noname/third party but they are still a lens that works)...the ones I cut my teeth on before I knew which lenses I liked using.I am not sure I am making a profit but moving them on that others can use them....I understand about the emotional attachment to a lens but not a handbag Laughing

I believe this is a key statement as to why we do what we do,being able to afford quality made in the past as compared to paying a high price for todays lenses.A little Nostalgic perhaps but the lenses are still practical. Very Happy

" Also these cameras demanded such a high price, many people admired them in magazines, but never saw them in the flesh, let alone could afford them"
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