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kyrcy
Joined: 23 Feb 2015 Posts: 124
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 3:47 am Post subject: Tair-3s blades problem |
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kyrcy wrote:
I have found a Tair-3s lens made in the late 80s that seems to be in like new condition, but the aperture does not seem to work correctly. The blades are not stuck, but they don't seem to close or open correctly. How easy is to fix such a problem?
Last edited by kyrcy on Thu Apr 02, 2020 10:01 am; edited 1 time in total |
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sergtum
Joined: 14 Nov 2016 Posts: 735
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 4:47 am Post subject: |
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sergtum wrote:
I did not quite understand the problem of your lens. So I limit myself to a reference to the lens assembly sequence. To disassemble the lens is not difficult. Disassembly is carried out in the reverse order.
http://liveviewer.ru/0911-2013/razborka-tair-3fs/ |
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lucca1x
Joined: 09 Feb 2014 Posts: 93 Location: Romania
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 7:25 am Post subject: |
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lucca1x wrote:
Just asking : did you armed the aperture mechanism before trying to change the aperture?
If you did, try posting some pics relevant for your problem. |
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Lightshow
Joined: 04 Nov 2011 Posts: 3669 Location: Calgary
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 12:40 pm Post subject: |
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Lightshow wrote:
Need a better description of what is happening, vs. what you expect to happen, ideally pictures or video would be best. _________________ A Manual Focus Junky...
One photographers junk lens is an artists favorite tool.
My lens list
http://www.flickr.com/photos/lightshow-photography/ |
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kyrcy
Joined: 23 Feb 2015 Posts: 124
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 4:55 pm Post subject: |
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kyrcy wrote:
Yes, I did arm the aperture mechanism before trying to change the aperture.
Here are two pictures showing the problem, first with half aperture open and second with full aperture open:
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TAo2
Joined: 09 Mar 2012 Posts: 319 Location: Scotland
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 6:06 pm Post subject: |
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TAo2 wrote:
Hi kyrcy,
That looks like rust on the blades? |
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kyrcy
Joined: 23 Feb 2015 Posts: 124
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 6:26 pm Post subject: |
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kyrcy wrote:
TAo2 wrote: |
Hi kyrcy,
That looks like rust on the blades? |
I think it's oil.
At least one blade seems to be loose and is probably causing the problem.
I could take the lens for service, but if it is a simple task I could try repair it myself. |
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lucca1x
Joined: 09 Feb 2014 Posts: 93 Location: Romania
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:06 pm Post subject: |
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lucca1x wrote:
If you are not used to dismantle lenses or you are unsure in doing this, leave the job to a professional, but if you want to give it a try this should be a good start:
http://forum.mflenses.com/tair-3-300-4-5-part-of-the-photosniper-repair-guide-t27056,highlight,%2Btair+%2Brepair.html |
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kyrcy
Joined: 23 Feb 2015 Posts: 124
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:20 pm Post subject: |
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kyrcy wrote:
I am not used to dismantle lenses and for sure I am unsure in doing this, but it will probably cost as much as I paid for the lens itself if not more to repair it. |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3693 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:25 pm Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
It is common problem since there are three strong springs to quick step down. Never close aperture with quick release from wide open to F8 and higher, if apertures aren't clean and tested. _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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kyrcy
Joined: 23 Feb 2015 Posts: 124
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Posted: Mon Jul 17, 2017 8:56 pm Post subject: |
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kyrcy wrote:
From what I read I understand that I need to completely disassemble the lens in order to reach the diaphragm. Do I risk messing something up while doing so such as infinity focus? |
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sergtum
Joined: 14 Nov 2016 Posts: 735
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Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 4:56 am Post subject: |
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sergtum wrote:
I repaired the same breakdown of Tair two years ago. I do not remember the details of the repair. But I can draw your attention to the following circumstances: 1 - there was no problem with infinity; 2 - the screws are very brittle. It is necessary to have some stock of such screws before starting the repair; 3 - it is also desirable to have a spare spring. At me one spring has lost the elastic properties. I replaced this spring. 4 - it is necessary to mark the part of the lens with the marker when disassembling it. Otherwise, there may be problems opening the aperture. The diaphragm may not open completely if it is not assembled correctly. |
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kyrcy
Joined: 23 Feb 2015 Posts: 124
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Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 1:33 pm Post subject: |
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kyrcy wrote:
sergtum wrote: |
I repaired the same breakdown of Tair two years ago. I do not remember the details of the repair. But I can draw your attention to the following circumstances: 1 - there was no problem with infinity; 2 - the screws are very brittle. It is necessary to have some stock of such screws before starting the repair; 3 - it is also desirable to have a spare spring. At me one spring has lost the elastic properties. I replaced this spring. 4 - it is necessary to mark the part of the lens with the marker when disassembling it. Otherwise, there may be problems opening the aperture. The diaphragm may not open completely if it is not assembled correctly. |
I have no spare screws or a spring and I very much doubt if I could find any to buy locally. What is the purpose of marking the various parts? Just to remember the order to assembly or are there specific positions for some parts? And do I need to follow all steps in the link you posted in order to reach the diaphragm? |
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sergtum
Joined: 14 Nov 2016 Posts: 735
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Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 2:08 pm Post subject: |
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sergtum wrote:
Marking is needed for proper assembly. To mark it is necessary extractable from each other details. Then put them in the right place. Only as an example, the marking of the Triothar during its repair:
http://www.digicamclub.de/showthread.php?t=8586&s=9a9a94272ebf163a611b5342761e7d62&highlight=Triotar |
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Eddie46
Joined: 05 Dec 2016 Posts: 135 Location: cardiff,UK
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Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 2:35 pm Post subject: |
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Eddie46 wrote:
Could it be possible to just remove the Glassware and dribble some 'lighter fluid' onto the Iris and 'work' it open and closed a few times,without actually disassembling the bodywork etc? |
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lucca1x
Joined: 09 Feb 2014 Posts: 93 Location: Romania
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Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:00 pm Post subject: |
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lucca1x wrote:
Eddie46 wrote: |
Could it be possible to just remove the Glassware and dribble some 'lighter fluid' onto the Iris and 'work' it open and closed a few times,without actually disassembling the bodywork etc? |
I doubt that. The blades are a bit rusty (it's not grease or oil...), they must be cleaned on both sides and more important one of the pins of the hanging blade it's out of place (hopefully not broken) and must be seated correctly. |
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kyrcy
Joined: 23 Feb 2015 Posts: 124
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Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:14 pm Post subject: |
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kyrcy wrote:
What I am suppose to be marking? And how do I mark a lens with a black body?
I am not sure if I should start practicing with disassembly using this lens.
It's not that I paid much for it, but it will be such a waste to throw it away if something goes wrong. |
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jamaeolus
Joined: 19 Mar 2014 Posts: 2913 Location: Eugene
Expire: 2015-08-20
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Posted: Tue Jul 18, 2017 3:52 pm Post subject: |
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jamaeolus wrote:
I recommend marking with a sharpy. It will come off with isopropyl alcohol. It may not be easy to put the lens back with the correct orientation (ie front to back may LOOK the same but be optically different). I have never repaired an iris before but I recommend doing some web searches of what is involved. Most are likely to have a similar kind of construction if you can't find Tair 3 specific images. Many tiny parts are frequently encountered in some of these lenses (I have no Tair lens so I can't address that, but I have taken some Topcon, and Asahi and Minolta and Canon lenses apart) Take photos with your cell phone to remind yourself where things go. Disassembly should be accomplished on a large table with clean white paper on top to assist in finding tiny parts that jump out of your hands. Use a muffin tin or egg crate to keep small parts in the order you took them out. Many small parts may look similar but not be interchangeable (eg different screw lengths, similar springs etc). I noticed there was a Tair 3 for sale "For Parts" on ebay right now. might be worth investigating. I have used multiple "parts' lenses to get one complete lens in the past as well. Good luck. _________________ photos are moments frozen in time |
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kyrcy
Joined: 23 Feb 2015 Posts: 124
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Posted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 7:21 pm Post subject: |
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kyrcy wrote:
I asked and it will cost up to 100 euro for a professional to repair the lens depending on the amount of time it will take. Does this sound reasonable?
Last edited by kyrcy on Fri Jul 21, 2017 9:29 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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visualopsins
Joined: 05 Mar 2009 Posts: 10463 Location: California
Expire: 2021-06-22
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Posted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 8:25 pm Post subject: |
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visualopsins wrote:
Sergtum gives good advice, backed with experience...
I think (s)he refers to marking the position of the focusing helicals where they separate, so that position can be duplicated on reassembly -- necessary, because, as there are multiple threads, there are multiple starting positions, but only one position is correct for proper focusing.
Check with your local camera shoppe -- somebody there may be able to fix it, or knows someone. _________________ ☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮ like attracts like! ☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮
Cameras: Sony A7Rii, Spotmatics II, F, and ESII, Nikon P4
M42 Asahi Optical Co., Lenses:
Takumar 1:4 f=35mm, 1:2 f=58mm (Sonnar), 1:2.4 f=58mm (Heliar), 1:2.2 f=55mm (Gaussian), 1:2.8 f=105mm (Model I), 1:2.8/105 (Model II), 1:5.6/200
Tele-Takumar 1:5.6/200, 1:6.3/300
Macro-Takumar 1:4/50
Auto-Takumar 1:2.3 f=35, 1:1.8 f=55mm, 1:2.2 f=55mm
Super-TAKUMAR 1:3.5/28 (fat), 1:2/35 (Fat), 1:1.4/50 (8-element),
Super-Multi-Coated Fisheye-TAKUMAR 1:4/17
Super-Multi-Coated TAKUMAR 1:4.5/20, 1:3.5/24, 1:3.5/28, 1:2/35, 1:3.5/35, 1:1.8/85, 1:1.9/85 1:2.8/105, 1:3.5/135, 1:2.5/135 (II), 1:4/150, 1:4/200, 1:4/300, 1:4.5/500
Super-Multi-Coated Macro-TAKUMAR 1:4/50, 1:4/100
Super-Multi-Coated Bellows-TAKUMAR 1:4/100
SMC TAKUMAR 1:1.4/50, 1:1.8/55
Other lenses:
Carl Zeiss Jena Flektogon 2.4/35
SMC PENTAX ZOOM 1:3.5 35~105mm, SMC PENTAX ZOOM 1:4 45~125mm
Nikon Micro-NIKKOR-P-C Auto 1:3.5 f=55mm, NIKKOR-P Auto 105mm f/2.5 Pre-AI (Sonnar), Micro-NIKKOR 105mm 1:4 AI, NIKKOR AI-S 35-135mm f/3,5-4,5
Tamron SP 17mm f/3.5 (51B), Tamron SP 17mm f/3.5 (51BB), SP 500mm f/8 (55BB), SP 70-210mm f/3.5 (19AH)
Vivitar 100mm 1:2.8 MC 1:1 Macro Telephoto
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lucca1x
Joined: 09 Feb 2014 Posts: 93 Location: Romania
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Posted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 9:39 pm Post subject: |
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lucca1x wrote:
visualopsins wrote: |
I think (s)he refers to marking the position of the focusing helicals where they separate... |
This is very important with most lenses but the Tair 3s has no focus helical.
As for the 100 euro for servicing the lens it depends . It's a 2 hours job at most including 2 - 3 coffee breaks, but the charge varies in different services and countries .
I have another suggestion for you if you are not in hurry : try the lens as is, with the faulty blade, don't change the aperture. If you are lucky will get some pictures good enough to tell if you like the lens or not.
Then take a decision. |
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visualopsins
Joined: 05 Mar 2009 Posts: 10463 Location: California
Expire: 2021-06-22
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Posted: Fri Jul 21, 2017 10:59 pm Post subject: |
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visualopsins wrote:
Here's some pics to compare
http://forum.mflenses.com/tair-3-300mm-an-impressive-performance-t40947.html _________________ ☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮ like attracts like! ☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮☮
Cameras: Sony A7Rii, Spotmatics II, F, and ESII, Nikon P4
M42 Asahi Optical Co., Lenses:
Takumar 1:4 f=35mm, 1:2 f=58mm (Sonnar), 1:2.4 f=58mm (Heliar), 1:2.2 f=55mm (Gaussian), 1:2.8 f=105mm (Model I), 1:2.8/105 (Model II), 1:5.6/200
Tele-Takumar 1:5.6/200, 1:6.3/300
Macro-Takumar 1:4/50
Auto-Takumar 1:2.3 f=35, 1:1.8 f=55mm, 1:2.2 f=55mm
Super-TAKUMAR 1:3.5/28 (fat), 1:2/35 (Fat), 1:1.4/50 (8-element),
Super-Multi-Coated Fisheye-TAKUMAR 1:4/17
Super-Multi-Coated TAKUMAR 1:4.5/20, 1:3.5/24, 1:3.5/28, 1:2/35, 1:3.5/35, 1:1.8/85, 1:1.9/85 1:2.8/105, 1:3.5/135, 1:2.5/135 (II), 1:4/150, 1:4/200, 1:4/300, 1:4.5/500
Super-Multi-Coated Macro-TAKUMAR 1:4/50, 1:4/100
Super-Multi-Coated Bellows-TAKUMAR 1:4/100
SMC TAKUMAR 1:1.4/50, 1:1.8/55
Other lenses:
Carl Zeiss Jena Flektogon 2.4/35
SMC PENTAX ZOOM 1:3.5 35~105mm, SMC PENTAX ZOOM 1:4 45~125mm
Nikon Micro-NIKKOR-P-C Auto 1:3.5 f=55mm, NIKKOR-P Auto 105mm f/2.5 Pre-AI (Sonnar), Micro-NIKKOR 105mm 1:4 AI, NIKKOR AI-S 35-135mm f/3,5-4,5
Tamron SP 17mm f/3.5 (51B), Tamron SP 17mm f/3.5 (51BB), SP 500mm f/8 (55BB), SP 70-210mm f/3.5 (19AH)
Vivitar 100mm 1:2.8 MC 1:1 Macro Telephoto
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