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greenbeens
Joined: 18 Feb 2013 Posts: 23
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Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 12:02 pm Post subject: Pentacon 200mm vs Meyer 200mm f4 |
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greenbeens wrote:
I can found Pentacon 200mm f4 for 30 euro on ebay and the Meyer-Optik Görlitz Orestegor 200mm f4 for 100 euro, so I wish to know if them perform the same or there are differences in the glasses (because all the other mechanical parts are very close each others). does them perform differently in therms of sharpness and color aberrations?
for example those 2 are the same or different?
does maybe exist 2 versions of pentacon 200 f4 and one of them is the preset? which is it the one in the photo I posted? (If you can give me "the ok" I could buy it if you tell me it is the same as the meyer bacause I found a seller for good price).
becaus i have found those 2 review and I'm confused.
1: https://www.pentaxforums.com/userreviews/pentacon-200mm-f4-preset.html
2: https://www.pentaxforums.com/userreviews/meyer-optik-g-rlitz-orestegor-200mm-f4.html
thanks! |
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tb_a
Joined: 26 Jan 2010 Posts: 3678 Location: Austria
Expire: 2019-08-28
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Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 12:38 pm Post subject: |
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tb_a wrote:
Meyer lenses manufactured as from 1971 have been marked as "Pentacon"; i.e. the Pentacon is the newer lens. Both versions are preset lenses and more or less identical. _________________ Thomas Bernardy
Manual focus lenses mainly from Minolta, Pentax, Voigtlaender, Leitz, Topcon and from Russia (too many to be listed here). |
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Lloydy
Joined: 02 Sep 2009 Posts: 7776 Location: Ironbridge. UK.
Expire: 2022-01-01
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Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 12:39 pm Post subject: |
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Lloydy wrote:
It's the same lens, just different names. This is my 'PentaMog' which is various parts from a Pentacon and a Meyer lens thrown together to make a great lens, you can see the zebra finish of the M.O.G. focus ring and the knurled finish of the Pentacon pre set ring. The tripod mount is from an old Soligor zoom. It's one of my favorite lenses.
_________________ LENSES & CAMERAS FOR SALE.....
I have loads of stuff that I have to get rid of, if you see me commenting about something I have got and you want one, ask me.
My Flickr https://www.flickr.com/photos/mudplugga/
My ipernity -
http://www.ipernity.com/home/294337 |
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buerokratiehasser
Joined: 12 Jun 2011 Posts: 470
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Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 1:55 pm Post subject: |
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buerokratiehasser wrote:
The Pentacon maybe being later copies, perhaps could have more advanced coatings and be generally younger (less worn)? |
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greenbeens
Joined: 18 Feb 2013 Posts: 23
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Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 2:34 pm Post subject: |
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greenbeens wrote:
I'm sorry but I'm very confused.
Which is it this lens?
Is it the ones this link? (1): https://www.pentaxforums.com/userreviews/pentacon-200mm-f4-preset.html
Or is it the ones of this link? (2): https://www.pentaxforums.com/userreviews/meyer-optik-g-rlitz-orestegor-200mm-f4.html
Or the lenses in the 2 links are the same and the review 1 and 2 don't mean anything? They describe them so different (color aberation and sharpness values are huge different).
Thx! |
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tb_a
Joined: 26 Jan 2010 Posts: 3678 Location: Austria
Expire: 2019-08-28
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Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 4:51 pm Post subject: |
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tb_a wrote:
greenbeens wrote: |
I'm sorry but I'm very confused.
Or the lenses in the 2 links are the same and the review 1 and 2 don't mean anything? They describe them so different (color aberation and sharpness values are huge different). |
As already stated above: Those lenses are (besides some outer cosmetically differences) identical and the Meyer lens is the older make and the Pentacon the newer one.
However, those reviews at Pentaxforums are nothing else than the personal and subjective views of any members of that forum.
Furthermore you should be aware that the sample variation of such old lenses might be very high. I have a Pentacon 50mm/F1.8 (AKA Meyer-Optik Goerlitz Oreston) lens which is looking like new and it's an awful and unsharp lens although I've seen pictures from others from the same lens which are looking very good. That's the general problem you may encounter when you are looking for old GDR made lenses. _________________ Thomas Bernardy
Manual focus lenses mainly from Minolta, Pentax, Voigtlaender, Leitz, Topcon and from Russia (too many to be listed here). |
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Lloydy
Joined: 02 Sep 2009 Posts: 7776 Location: Ironbridge. UK.
Expire: 2022-01-01
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Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 5:30 pm Post subject: |
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Lloydy wrote:
I made the 'PentaMog' out of two Pentacon and one M.O.G. lens that all had various faults from damaged body to broken optics. I stripped all three lenses, laid all the parts out, and picked the best. I've even mixed the individual lenses. I could see no difference at all in any of the individual parts - other than the cosmetic difference of the knurled or zebra finish on the rings and the engraving. _________________ LENSES & CAMERAS FOR SALE.....
I have loads of stuff that I have to get rid of, if you see me commenting about something I have got and you want one, ask me.
My Flickr https://www.flickr.com/photos/mudplugga/
My ipernity -
http://www.ipernity.com/home/294337 |
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greenbeens
Joined: 18 Feb 2013 Posts: 23
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Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 9:13 pm Post subject: |
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greenbeens wrote:
Lloydy wrote: |
I made the 'PentaMog' out of two Pentacon and one M.O.G. lens that all had various faults from damaged body to broken optics. I stripped all three lenses, laid all the parts out, and picked the best. I've even mixed the individual lenses. I could see no difference at all in any of the individual parts - other than the cosmetic difference of the knurled or zebra finish on the rings and the engraving. |
humm. you're certainly giving me something to think about: I'm not sure my Canon 7D can handle the weight of this lens, I will use it for video. I mean I will not help the camera with the weight of the lens holding it in my hand because it will be on the tripod. Your mod help this because the tripod can hold the lens directly. Do you believe the weight of this telephoto can damage my Canon 7D if I use it on a tripod without the mod?
I'm also considering buyng the Pentacon 300mm f4, it have this solution on board it self. Do you know if it would be a good choice please?
thx! |
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Lloydy
Joined: 02 Sep 2009 Posts: 7776 Location: Ironbridge. UK.
Expire: 2022-01-01
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Posted: Wed Jun 21, 2017 11:35 pm Post subject: |
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Lloydy wrote:
I use this lens on my Sony A6000, NEX5 and Pentax K10 with no problems. It IS heavy, make no mistake about that. But the weight does not make it hard to use. It's a different way of handling the camera and lens - I treat it as a big heavy lens with a camera on the back, not the usual thinking of a camera with a heavy lens. I adjust the way I handle the whole thing and ease the load on the lens mount. Which I think would handle the weight anyway.
The tripod mount on mine is clamped onto the tapered part of the lens, the mount is a bigger diameter than the taper and the difference is made up with some flexible polythene cut from a 5 liter oil container that is glued inside the tripod mount, it's soft enough to grip the taper tight enough to use without falling off. It's not 100% solid, but it's never given me any problems - it's solid enough to use.
The difference in price of the two lenses might be down to the mount, a M42 mount will probably command a higher price than an Exacta, which are fairly common. The saving grace is - the mount is easy to change because it unscrews off the back of the lens and they are interchangeable. The down side is - mounts on their own are not easy to find, especially M42.
If you're after a Pentacon version I do have one that I would sell, I don't actually need three of them _________________ LENSES & CAMERAS FOR SALE.....
I have loads of stuff that I have to get rid of, if you see me commenting about something I have got and you want one, ask me.
My Flickr https://www.flickr.com/photos/mudplugga/
My ipernity -
http://www.ipernity.com/home/294337 |
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greenbeens
Joined: 18 Feb 2013 Posts: 23
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Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:01 am Post subject: |
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greenbeens wrote:
thx for your reply Lloydy, well I can be more calm about not worry for breaking the 7D because of the lens heavy weight, and this is a very good news. I will think about your offer thank you very much, but for now I should have found one copy. There is also another problem because I'm a little bit confused now if to buy the 200mm ot the 300mm. I should basically use this lens to shoot live bands concerts (only video) on a video tripod. I never used a telephoto to do it in my life. I wish to shoot for aiming only at people close-up of the face and theyr shoulders. I'm trying to understand if I can do it with the 200mm because it is cheap (less than 40 euro), but on the other side there are about 150 euro to spend for the 300mm f4 (pentacon). I'have huge economic problems (40 vs 150 euro is a huge difference for me), so now that I have to start this new job (it's also a job at budget zero but this is another story lol) I wish to start with the right equipment. Do you have any advice for this shooting situation please?
I'm trying to understand something doing this simulation: http://dofsimulator.net/en/
The concerts stage will not be huge I suppose (like the big festivals). So I guess I could go close enough but it's not possible to understand how close because I have no experience unfortunately. Today I talked with one of the guys who I should work with, and he said that my idea is possible, but I will be not placed right under the front stage. I will need to find a periferical place, for me is better because I dislike the confusion of being under the stage, I wish to sit on a tall stool with a long lens and do all I can from there (I'm a little bit kind of agoraphobic). |
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jamaeolus
Joined: 19 Mar 2014 Posts: 2913 Location: Eugene
Expire: 2015-08-20
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Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 12:56 am Post subject: |
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jamaeolus wrote:
Bear in mind that these (used) lenses, as a general rule, are things you buy at a given price but then can sell again for very nearly the same price, sometimes more (if you are lucky!). Buy the best you can afford. Also don't feel restricted to Pentacon/Meyer. There are many many great lenses out there that give excellent performance in the price range you are looking at. You can get a Asahi pentax 200mm f4 for 35 USD and it is certainly a serviceable lens. Topcon RE are also very good and quite inexpensive. _________________ photos are moments frozen in time |
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tb_a
Joined: 26 Jan 2010 Posts: 3678 Location: Austria
Expire: 2019-08-28
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Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 6:20 am Post subject: |
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tb_a wrote:
jamaeolus wrote: |
There are many many great lenses out there that give excellent performance in the price range you are looking at. You can get a Asahi pentax 200mm f4 for 35 USD and it is certainly a serviceable lens. |
That's certainly true. Additionally the mechanical quality of Pentax Takumar lenses is far superior to Meyer/Pentacon ones. Most probably the optical quality as well. _________________ Thomas Bernardy
Manual focus lenses mainly from Minolta, Pentax, Voigtlaender, Leitz, Topcon and from Russia (too many to be listed here). |
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Pancolart
Joined: 04 Feb 2008 Posts: 3693 Location: Slovenia, EU
Expire: 2013-11-18
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Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 7:23 am Post subject: |
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Pancolart wrote:
Lloydy wrote: |
It IS heavy, make no mistake about that. But the weight does not make it hard to use. It's a different way of handling the camera and lens - I treat it as a big heavy lens with a camera on the back, not the usual thinking of a camera with a heavy lens. I adjust the way I handle the whole thing and ease the load on the lens mount. Which I think would handle the weight anyway.
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+1 _________________ ---------------------------------
The Peculiar Apparatus Of Victorian Steampunk Photography: 100+ Genuine Steampunk Camera Designs https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0B92829NS |
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Vics42
Joined: 10 May 2015 Posts: 15 Location: Sevilla, Spain
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Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 10:41 am Post subject: |
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Vics42 wrote:
Just my two cents for this topic.
As far as I know, there are two versions of the Pentacon 200 f/4: the first one, that mantained the 15 blade diafragm design of the Meyer Optik lens, and a later one with just 6 or 8 blades.
Perhaps thats the reason of the price difference. _________________ Returning to amateur photography after 25 years apart.
Sony A77M2
Minolta AF: 24-50; 35-70, 35-105; 70-210
MF: CZJ 50 1.8; 50 2.8; 135 3.5
PENTACON 30 3.5; 135 2.8; 200 f4 TAKUMAR 28 3.5; 35 2.8; 135 3.5 RUSSIAN: H44M; H44-2; J37A; J21M; J11; J9; MIR1B
http://www.flickr.com/photos/112358743@N05 |
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heritagecameras
Joined: 19 Feb 2011 Posts: 102 Location: UK
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Posted: Thu Jun 22, 2017 2:38 pm Post subject: |
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heritagecameras wrote:
Vics42 wrote: |
As far as I know, there are two versions of the Pentacon 200 f/4: the first one, that mantained the 15 blade diafragm design of the Meyer Optik lens, and a later one with just 6 or 8 blades. Perhaps thats the reason of the price difference. |
If I remember correctly the manual/preset versions of this lens had many blades, but the number was reduced when the automatic diaphragm model was introduced. Perhaps the friction of all those blades was too much for the auto mechanisms of the day? _________________ Dave, HCL |
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greenbeens
Joined: 18 Feb 2013 Posts: 23
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Posted: Sat Jun 24, 2017 10:06 pm Post subject: |
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greenbeens wrote:
edit. |
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