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Konica Hexanon AR 1.4/50 or 1.4/57 which one to keep?
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PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 12:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
timo832000 wrote:
grrrr - That was not what I wanted to hear. It`s the reason why I already have the Summicron-R 50, The SMC Pentax M 1.4/50, The SMC Pentax M 1.7/50 and the Tomioka 1.4/55. They are all great lenses!


Don't worry.I have more than 20 differnet 50/1.4 lenses and more than forty 40/45/50/55/58/60mm lenses altogether,so you're excused Very Happy


PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 2:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
shapencolour wrote:
timo832000 wrote:
grrrr - That was not what I wanted to hear. It`s the reason why I already have the Summicron-R 50, The SMC Pentax M 1.4/50, The SMC Pentax M 1.7/50 and the Tomioka 1.4/55. They are all great lenses!


Don't worry.I have more than 20 differnet 50/1.4 lenses and more than forty 40/45/50/55/58/60mm lenses altogether,so you're excused Very Happy


That's truly a lot of 50ishmm lenses Shocked have you thought of doing a test with at least some of them cause that would be great for your own reference and to others who are thinking of buying one.

I have thought of doing a test with maybe around 18-20 50ishmm lenses I have to determine which I should keep and which I'm getting rid of. But I think I'm never gonna do it cause I would rather spend the time actually shooting than doing tests... Rolling Eyes


PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 7:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
bruzzo wrote:
shapencolour wrote:
timo832000 wrote:
grrrr - That was not what I wanted to hear. It`s the reason why I already have the Summicron-R 50, The SMC Pentax M 1.4/50, The SMC Pentax M 1.7/50 and the Tomioka 1.4/55. They are all great lenses!


Don't worry.I have more than 20 differnet 50/1.4 lenses and more than forty 40/45/50/55/58/60mm lenses altogether,so you're excused Very Happy


That's truly a lot of 50ishmm lenses Shocked have you thought of doing a test with at least some of them cause that would be great for your own reference and to others who are thinking of buying one.

I have thought of doing a test with maybe around 18-20 50ishmm lenses I have to determine which I should keep and which I'm getting rid of. But I think I'm never gonna do it cause I would rather spend the time actually shooting than doing tests... Rolling Eyes


The problem is I have little time for photography,so if I get some,my preference goes to just taking real life pictures instead of tests.Vast majority of my approximately 180 lenses have never had a good go because of time shortage.So there are still some waiting for that. Very Happy


PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 7:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Side-by-side testing of 50mm lenses is close to pointless. I once did it with 13 of them and the differences were miniscule. The choice of which was 'best' became purely a matter of taste.


PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 7:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Even though my Tomioka (Porst) 1.4/55 is not in the best shape and I don`t use it very often, I will not give it away. I was given this lens from my father who used it in the early eighties to take images of me when i was a baby child.


My first impression of the two Hexanons (50&57) is that my copy of the 57 has much better build quality than the 50, while the 50 is more contrasty and seems to have less abberations.


I am not going to shoot test images from test charts but I will try to make some comparision images.


Timo


PostPosted: Tue Apr 15, 2014 7:39 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Yes, the 50 is multi-coated, the 57 single coated and the 50 is more highly corrected. however that means the 57 has more character at large apertures.


PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 7:54 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I have both, the 57mm is the old 1.4 after that you only got 50/1.4's. The new version is rather sharper, but I love the splinned metal and soft character of the 57mm colour and contrast are on both lenses great. But I wouldn't sell either.
I have all the konica's 50's (AR's), you can never have enough 50's Smile


PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 9:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Yes, the 50 is multi-coated, the 57 single coated and the 50 is more highly corrected. however that means the 57 has more character at large apertures.


Actually, only the earliest of the 57/1.4 are single coated. They are the ones with the amber/gold coating. Such lenses will invariably have (I’ve never seen any that didn’t) an aluminum ring on the barrel. Yet aluminum ring 57/1.4 can be found with either the single amber/gold coating or Konica’s blue/purple tinged multiple Color Dynamic Coating (CDC). Konica replaced aluminum ring lenses with entirely black ones around 1970, and this roughly coincided in time with the introduction of the second-version Autoreflex T. If the number of aluminum-ring 57/1.4 Hexanons with CDC are any indication, it would seem that Konica introduced its Color Dynamic Coating sometime in the late sixties, which was very early. Incidentally, the 57/1.4 was made until mid-1973 or so.

Ad OP: I would also keep both lenses. The 50/1.4 is a very sharp lens that is also famous for its beautiful color rendition. But the 57/1.4 has much more of an individual character. I especially like the smooth and contrasty B&W photographs it produces. They have what’s referred to in Polish as “great plasticity”, and the 3D effect is such that the scene seems to jump out of the picture. It’s one of my favorite lenses.


PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 12:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
konicamera wrote:
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Yes, the 50 is multi-coated, the 57 single coated and the 50 is more highly corrected. however that means the 57 has more character at large apertures.


Actually, only the earliest of the 57/1.4 are single coated. They are the ones with the amber/gold coating. Such lenses will invariably have (I’ve never seen any that didn’t) an aluminum ring on the barrel. Yet aluminum ring 57/1.4 can be found with either the single amber/gold coating or Konica’s blue/purple tinged multiple Color Dynamic Coating (CDC). Konica replaced aluminum ring lenses with entirely black ones around 1970, and this roughly coincided in time with the introduction of the second-version Autoreflex T. If the number of aluminum-ring 57/1.4 Hexanons with CDC are any indication, it would seem that Konica introduced its Color Dynamic Coating sometime in the late sixties, which was very early. Incidentally, the 57/1.4 was made until mid-1973 or so.

Ad OP: I would also keep both lenses. The 50/1.4 is a very sharp lens that is also famous for its beautiful color rendition. But the 57/1.4 has much more of an individual character. I especially like the smooth and contrasty B&W photographs it produces. They have what’s referred to in Polish as “great plasticity”, and the 3D effect is such that the scene seems to jump out of the picture. It’s one of my favorite lenses.


Darn you, konicamera, you know way too much about Konica matters for my own good! Very Happy Laughing

Your post sent me straightaway off to my lens drawer to investigate. I have only one copy of the 57. Those things are really expensive. Anyway, mine has the blue/purple CDC along with the aluminum ring.

I have to wonder which version is owned by the OP. I don't think that has yet been revealed on this thread. If he has, as you do, the older amber/gold single coating version, that alone might be reason to keep the lens!! I'd not mind at all owning one of those myself!


PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 3:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
guardian wrote:

Darn you, konicamera, you know way too much about Konica matters for my own good! Very Happy Laughing

Your post sent me straightaway off to my lens drawer to investigate. I have only one copy of the 57. Those things are really expensive. Anyway, mine has the blue/purple CDC along with the aluminum ring.

I have to wonder which version is owned by the OP. I don't think that has yet been revealed on this thread. If he has, as you do, the older amber/gold single coating version, that alone might be reason to keep the lens!! I'd not mind at all owning one of those myself!


Actually, I don't know nearly as much as I'd like to. With the exception of a relatively small number of lens brochures, Konica hasn't published any information about its lenses, their different versions, etc. One is forced to rely on observation. Hexanons have been my main squeeze since the late seventies and, especially in the last 10 years, I've been looking at them very closely and taking careful notes. Smile

If you'd like to get one, the 57/1.4 Hexanon with amber/gold coatings is not that uncommon. One way to spot one on auction sites is by the inscriptions on the front ring. They are in BIG BLOCK LETTERS LIKE THESE. The switch from this font to the later more discrete one took place around the time the Autoreflex T - first version was introduced (1968), and seems to coincide with the introduction of the Color Dynamic Coating. I haven't been able to ascertain with any great certainty just how closely related the latter two developments are, but it looks fairly close.


PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 4:56 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
konicamera wrote:
iangreenhalgh1 wrote:
Yes, the 50 is multi-coated, the 57 single coated and the 50 is more highly corrected. however that means the 57 has more character at large apertures.


Actually, only the earliest of the 57/1.4 are single coated. They are the ones with the amber/gold coating. Such lenses will invariably have (I’ve never seen any that didn’t) an aluminum ring on the barrel. Yet aluminum ring 57/1.4 can be found with either the single amber/gold coating or Konica’s blue/purple tinged multiple Color Dynamic Coating (CDC). Konica replaced aluminum ring lenses with entirely black ones around 1970, and this roughly coincided in time with the introduction of the second-version Autoreflex T. If the number of aluminum-ring 57/1.4 Hexanons with CDC are any indication, it would seem that Konica introduced its Color Dynamic Coating sometime in the late sixties, which was very early. Incidentally, the 57/1.4 was made until mid-1973 or so.

Ad OP: I would also keep both lenses. The 50/1.4 is a very sharp lens that is also famous for its beautiful color rendition. But the 57/1.4 has much more of an individual character. I especially like the smooth and contrasty B&W photographs it produces. They have what’s referred to in Polish as “great plasticity”, and the 3D effect is such that the scene seems to jump out of the picture. It’s one of my favorite lenses.


Thanks for the correction. My 57 has the amber/straw coloured coating and aluminium ring.


PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 7:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
My 57 has the gold colored coating, and the capital letters on the front ring.
On the weekend I will have some time to take it out and snap some shots.

What do you think is about it`s special character? In which aperture range does it produce the most interesting results?
One thing I noticed while i made the first two or three test shots is that it is very sharp already wide open but suffers from chromatic aberrations and loss of contrast.

Timo


PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 7:34 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Hmm, my 57/1.4 is a late all black version such as this one (borrowed from buhla.de)



However, the coating looks amber to my eyes.


PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 7:42 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
fermy wrote:
Hmm, my 57/1.4 is a late all black version such as this one (borrowed from buhla.de)



However, the coating looks amber to my eyes.


As with all transitions from one Konica lens version to another, the new seems to coexist with the old for a while. That little while can go from a few months to a couple of years.


PostPosted: Wed Apr 16, 2014 8:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
timo832000 wrote:
My 57 has the gold colored coating, and the capital letters on the front ring.
On the weekend I will have some time to take it out and snap some shots.

What do you think is about it`s special character? In which aperture range does it produce the most interesting results?
One thing I noticed while i made the first two or three test shots is that it is very sharp already wide open but suffers from chromatic aberrations and loss of contrast.

Timo


1.4 - 4 is the place where the character sows, that loss of contrast and the smoothness is residual spherical aberration, same thing that makes the Biotars so well regarded.


PostPosted: Thu Apr 17, 2014 11:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Here's my 57/1.4 which shows an amber coating with hints of purple. And my cat.



PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 8:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Finally I decited to keep both!

Here is an image of the 57 on my Fuji






I really began to like this combination.


PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 8:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
I'm glad to hear that!! Konica sure do know how to make a good looking lens Wink


PostPosted: Mon Apr 28, 2014 9:25 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
timo832000 wrote:
Finally I decited to keep both!

Here is an image of the 57 on my Fuji

I really began to like this combination.


You have made the proper and correct decision beyond any doubt. Congratulations. It's a beautiful lens!


PostPosted: Tue Apr 29, 2014 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote
Konica 1.4/57@2 & Nex 5n:




Timo


PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 1:55 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
Beautiful bw shot. I have both of these lenses and also think you made a good choice. I kind of feel like for me 50s are really best used as portrait lenses, and I would rather have one that puts its stamp on the images and shows charcter than one that resolves like a macro lens or displays neutral characteristics (not that the Hexanon 50 1.4 is not an amazing lens too).

Like many folks here probably, I have several fast fifties including multiple 1.4s and a Rokkor 1.2, but I find myself reaching for my Minolta 58 1.4 most often, which has a similar feel to the Konica.


PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 2:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
A few from our recent trip to Sonoma, California.

Hexanon AR 50mm f/1.4, Sony A7









PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 3:17 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
I had both and prefered the 57 due more interesting character. I sold both later anyway Wink

I would simply make an wide open test comparision with some bokeh and some CA's between the two and then decide which you like more.


PostPosted: Wed Apr 30, 2014 8:40 am    Post subject: Reply with quote
timo832000 wrote:
Finally I decited to keep both!

Here is an image of the 57 on my Fuji






I really began to like this combination.

I'm glad you decided to keep both, as konica fan and can't forgive you other wise Cool
I would love to buy the all black version of the 57/1.4
Sad
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