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I've entered the NEXus or the NEXiverse... (photo added)
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PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2011 7:33 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

That's interesting.
IIRC, the NEX has the same sensor as the Pentax K20D.
The K20D cannot do video.
Perhaps they managed it to do it with this crop thing?


PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2011 8:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

To be able to record videos it has to be a CMOS sensor.

The 2x crop was chosen because of effectivity in HD mode. I have read something about it, but cannot find it anymore. Embarassed


PostPosted: Wed Jan 26, 2011 9:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

If it is really true then I needn't think about m4/3 and shoot video with Nex and use c-mount lenses without any hesitation? Has somebody such experience? some info or screens? and behavior like fourthirds while shooting? That sound more than appealing =)
...any facts are welcome


PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 12:09 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I thought it was just the same field of view as when taking stills and a "pixel binning" technique was used to downscale the sensor output to 1080 pixels.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 3:07 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

actually it's a 1.8x crop, according to those who tested, and the specs.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1042&message=36511409&changemode=1

also for fun:

Nikon to Nex Kipon Tilt Adapter 99USD shipped



28 f/2 AIS






135 f/2.8 AIS





55 F/2.8 micro AIS




PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:02 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

fatdeeman wrote:
I thought it was just the same field of view as when taking stills and a "pixel binning" technique was used to downscale the sensor output to 1080 pixels.

Same at me. Thus moire and sharpened pixels. In my experience with soft wide oped Helios 40 was image very good and crispy.

uhoh7 wrote:
actually it's a 1.8x crop, according to those who tested, and the specs.

http://forums.dpreview.com/forums/readflat.asp?forum=1042&message=36511409&changemode=1

also for fun:

Nikon to Nex Kipon Tilt Adapter 99USD shipped

Then you shooting video. Can you confirm that? It is really true?
Can I ask also about your experience with manual glass? Is it enough comfortable? Thanks in advance.

edit: I saw that chat or what it is about 1.8 crop. That are not very pleasing news. Although c-mount is more easy to use then.

Nice tilting, indeed. Sometimes it has really strong effect when it looks like model or miniature world.
But are there some cheaper adapters? =D[/b]


PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:43 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

spleenone wrote:

Same at me. Thus moire and sharpened pixels. In my experience with soft wide oped Helios 40 was image very good and crispy.

What's the question ?
You are wondering if the video will be less sharp and with more moire than the still picture?
Most probably it will. The picture size is 4592x3056 and the video is only 1280 x 720. You loose lots of data during the resize. Even if you are able to read the fine print of a newspaper from a still picture it will come out as unreadable dark spots on the 100% crop in the video.

Hand held video with non stabilized lenses on Nex is quite painful.. at least when you look it on the PC monitor. If you hook the Nex to a Bravia TV it looks better.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 4:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

spleenone wrote:

Then you shooting video. Can you confirm that? It is really true?
Can I ask also about your experience with manual glass? Is it enough comfortable? Thanks in advance.


If you are above 35mm, you want a monopod, anyway.

20 and 24mm are most usefull. Certainly you must concentrate to steady camera.

The f/2 and faster lense are very good in low light.

For video you don't need a sharp lens, hence the very fast sigma primes from 20 to 30mm are very good choices.

I have both VG10 and Nex-5. VG10 is steadyier.

best


PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

std wrote:
spleenone wrote:

Same at me. Thus moire and sharpened pixels. In my experience with soft wide oped Helios 40 was image very good and crispy.

What's the question ?
You are wondering if the video will be less sharp and with more moire than the still picture?
Most probably it will. The picture size is 4592x3056 and the video is only 1280 x 720. You loose lots of data during the resize. Even if you are able to read the fine print of a newspaper from a still picture it will come out as unreadable dark spots on the 100% crop in the video.

Hand held video with non stabilized lenses on Nex is quite painful.. at least when you look it on the PC monitor. If you hook the Nex to a Bravia TV it looks better.

I mean it was sharp enough. I guess that resizing or even down scaling in this way do some sharpening. Due I heard opinions like that video from cameras are too sharp.
Then you can shoot video on 1/30 with tele but it will be sharp not as in still but only shaky. Only =)


PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 9:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

uhoh7 wrote:

If you are above 35mm, you want a monopod, anyway.

20 and 24mm are most usefull. Certainly you must concentrate to steady camera.

The f/2 and faster lense are very good in low light.

For video you don't need a sharp lens, hence the very fast sigma primes from 20 to 30mm are very good choices.

I have both VG10 and Nex-5. VG10 is steadyier.

best

Agree about above. And thanks.

Now I think that Nex is not my way to shoot good moving pictures. In way that from Canon or Nikon is better output. Nothing speak about no video croping.
Currently I might wait for nex-7. Could be surprise for me.


PostPosted: Thu Jan 27, 2011 10:46 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As of tomorrow I too will have joined the club Very Happy

I am expecting delivery tomorrow of a NEX-3, 16mm pancake, 18-55mm OSS and M42 adapter (hopefully!).

Also coming in a few weeks will be a couple of body caps. Then I shall be adapting some very cool lenses Laughing

Can't wait!!!


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:08 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I haven't used the video too much yet but it seems pretty good so far and I agree that it's better to use a softer lens or a wide aperture, the sharper the image is coming into the camera the more moire and "stair stepping" seems to occur after down sampling. By the time the image is downsized it looks sharp anyway but setting a lens to f8 produces a lot more moire and stair stepping with no obvious gain in resolution.

I applied the firmware update which gives aperture priority for video mode and there seems to be exposure compensation and exposure lock.

The only real downside is there is no way to directly control the shutter speed and it seems to choose a speed too high for smooth movement in bright light.

After reading around it seems some people believe the camera will happily go down to 50-60 fps before upping iso so one trick people are using is to set the desired aperture and then use an nd filter of the required strength to get the shutter speed lower for smoother motion but not so low that the camera kicks the iso up and as a result puts the shutter speed back up.

There are a lot of people claiming this works and others who claiming it doesn't and that the camera ups the iso and shutter speed way before the shutter gets as low as 50-60fps

I haven't shot much video yet and am still awaiting adapters (seller on ebay sent me wrong ones so I have to wait for replacements) but I will report my findings later!


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 6:21 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Shrek wrote:
I am expecting delivery tomorrow of a NEX-3, 16mm pancake, 18-55mm OSS and M42 adapter (hopefully!).

great news! the lack of viewfinder refrained me until now
I will wait for your report


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:59 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

poilu wrote:
Shrek wrote:
I am expecting delivery tomorrow of a NEX-3, 16mm pancake, 18-55mm OSS and M42 adapter (hopefully!).

great news! the lack of viewfinder refrained me until now
I will wait for your report


This was exactly the reason I waited. However, I tried one in the shop and it was so easy to use...with incredible results Smile

If the adapter shows up today or tomorrow, I shall take the cam out and give a review from my perspective.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 12:57 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ManualFocus-G wrote:

This was exactly the reason I waited. However, I tried one in the shop and it was so easy to use...with incredible results Smile


Here we share the experience. Photokina and the chance to try the NEX changed my mind (and the price Wink).


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 2:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I'm still waiting on adapters but I have found the noise handling to be much much better than on the G1.

Images taken at iso 3200 make great A4 prints and are much much more than enough for web size images. This camera is probably better at iso 3200 than my G1 is at iso 800 and even then that's with native lenses, for some reason I cannot understand the g1 shows different noise characteristics with legacy lenses even with raw flies (ie worse) the NEX appears to give the same noise reduction regardless of what lens is attached.

I find the adobe raw converter (either in photoshop or lightroom) is the best for high iso shots and as always capture one is better for low iso due to it's ability to squeeze huge amounts of detail out of raw files but capture one does surprisingly well with the high iso shots too, it handles high iso raw shots better than it handles high iso shots from my G1

The nex-5 is not yet supported by capture one officially but I just changed the camera model in the raw header to the sony a550 using exifeditor and it processes the files fine. There is a huge amount of detail in those raw files when viewed in capture one, very impressive resolution just like I have seen in my G1

I intend to take the camera out to the harbour where I often try out lenses tomorrow, hopefully my adapter will arrive but if not the kit lens will do.

I'm very pleased by the IQ so far. How I would love for the NEX sensor to be in the G1 body!

Hopefully the NEX-7 will be like that and not cost the earth!

Here's a quick shot at iso 3200 with the kit lens, the sensor combined with the great noise reduction in camera raw gives great results!



PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 3:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I believe this camera has the same sensor as the Sony a450 which I've just sold, but I reckon it was improved for the NEX. Either way, I'm already hooked and I haven't even received an adapter yet! Laughing

Just picked up a complete set of Pentax 110 lenses and a Kern 13/1.9 which probably won't fit Laughing


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:27 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ManualFocus-G wrote:
and a Kern 13/1.9 which probably won't fit Laughing


That's the spirit!


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Wow, Dave, that's an exceptionally nice photo for ISO 3200! I'm impressed.

What is the max ISO on a NEX?


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 4:51 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cooltouch wrote:
Wow, Dave, that's an exceptionally nice photo for ISO 3200! I'm impressed.

What is the max ISO on a NEX?


12800 Smile


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 5:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ManualFocus-G wrote:

Just picked up a complete set of Pentax 110 lenses and a Kern 13/1.9 which probably won't fit Laughing


Neither of these lenses will cover the whole sensor, I guess.
The Pentax 110 lenses are kind of perfect for µ4/3.
And any c-mount lens below 25mm only shines a circular image in the centre.

I am waiting for a 25mm lens and will report if that one fits.

It's really difficult to find compact wide angle lenses for the NEX, thus the 16mm pancake is a must IMHO.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 5:54 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LucisPictor wrote:
ManualFocus-G wrote:

Just picked up a complete set of Pentax 110 lenses and a Kern 13/1.9 which probably won't fit Laughing


Neither of these lenses will cover the whole sensor, I guess.
The Pentax 110 lenses are kind of perfect for µ4/3.


Ah, but they will Wink

Click here to see on Ebay

http://www.flickr.com/photos/56473904@N05/5333353568/in/photostream/

The proof is in the pudding though!


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

cooltouch wrote:
Wow, Dave, that's an exceptionally nice photo for ISO 3200! I'm impressed.

What is the max ISO on a NEX?


Here's iso 12800 Shocked Shocked



You can see a little noise on an A4 print but not enough to intrude and it's still plenty for web use.

It just goes to show that more pixels can be better sometimes, as long as the quality is maintained at the pixel level. If you can have more pixels of the same quality then the noise will decreased simply by the image being squeezed down to fit normal viewing sizes. You can get the iso12800 images from this camera looking pretty good downsized to 6mp, much better than a 6mp camera set to iso 12800 would probably look.


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:11 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

ManualFocus-G wrote:
LucisPictor wrote:
ManualFocus-G wrote:

Just picked up a complete set of Pentax 110 lenses and a Kern 13/1.9 which probably won't fit Laughing


Neither of these lenses will cover the whole sensor, I guess.
The Pentax 110 lenses are kind of perfect for µ4/3.


Ah, but they will Wink

Click here to see on Ebay

http://www.flickr.com/photos/56473904@N05/5333353568/in/photostream/

The proof is in the pudding though!


I've been surprised by how many cctv and smaller format lenses work on the NEX, I didn't think any would work properly but I have seen a few cctv lenses giving full coverage or just a little vignetting!

The fujian/fujia etc 35mm f1.7 that's dirt cheap works well apparently!


PostPosted: Fri Jan 28, 2011 7:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

fatdeeman wrote:


The fujian/fujia etc 35mm f1.7 that's dirt cheap works well apparently!


That one definitely works, I've got this lens.


ManualFocus-G wrote:
LucisPictor wrote:
ManualFocus-G wrote:

Just picked up a complete set of Pentax 110 lenses and a Kern 13/1.9 which probably won't fit Laughing


Neither of these lenses will cover the whole sensor, I guess.
The Pentax 110 lenses are kind of perfect for µ4/3.


Ah, but they will Wink

Click here to see on Ebay

http://www.flickr.com/photos/56473904@N05/5333353568/in/photostream/

The proof is in the pudding though!


That would be a nice surprise!
The frame of the 110 is 13 × 17 mm, pretty much the size of µ4/3 but smaller than APS.

I'll keep my fingers crossed for you!