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Help! Will Retina-Longar-Xenon C f:4/80 fit my DKL adapter?
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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 7:26 pm    Post subject: Help! Will Retina-Longar-Xenon C f:4/80 fit my DKL adapter? Reply with quote

Hi folks,

i would like to buy following lens but i am not sure if it fits my dkl adapter. I think it should be fine but i would like to ask for your help/advise

Kodak Schneider-Kreuznach, Retina-Longar-Xenon C f:4/80 mm





and i am using this adapter

http://www.ebay.com/itm/130799598462?ssPageName=STRK:MEWNX:IT&_trksid=p3984.m1439.l2649

thanks!

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PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think the "c" retina lenses are to be used on a camera that has some of the optical elements fixed inside the body, like the zeiss ikon contaflex, and I think it won't work on a standard dkl adapter.


PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 7:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Your lens only fits to Retina IIIc with Xenon 50/2.

See here > http://camerapedia.wikia.com/wiki/Kodak_Retina_IIIc


PostPosted: Wed Oct 02, 2013 8:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thank you for kind help

is there any way how to find out quickly which lenses will fit my dkl adapter?

could you suggest where to go or how to find if lens will fit this dkl adapter?

i am struggling often Sad


PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 12:10 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Only a few cameras used the Deckel mount; the most popular ones were the Voigtlander Bessamatic and the Kodak Retina Reflex-S (both SLRs), and Kodak Retina IIIs rangefinder.
As discussed in this thread, http://forum.mflenses.com/retina-iiis-t61817.html
there are differences between SLR and RF coupling, but that doesn't matter for a DKL adapter, both types will fit.


PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 4:44 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

All of these lenses (below) will work with your DKL adapter. I've had or still have each of them, and have had no problems using them on my 7D with an adapter by cn-yeenon (eBay seller); the Skoparex and Septon had no mirror-clearance issues on my 5Dii, but that might be just my luck. The Schneiders will hit the 5D mirror. I can't say I've ever heard about mirror issues with Pentax digital bodies.

Schneider-Kreuznach Retina-Curtagon f2.8 35mm - very good colour rendition
Schneider-Kreuznach Retina Xenar f2.8 / 45mm
Schneider-Kreuznach Retina-Xenon f1.9 / 50mm - great lens!
Schneider-Kreuznach Retina-Xenar f2.8 / 50mm - soft to some, but I like it.
Schneider-Kreuznach Retina Tele-Xenar f4 / 135
Voigtlander Skoparex f3.4 35mm - great lens!
Voigtlander Septon f2 / 50mm
Voigtlander Super-Dynarex f4 / 135mm

There is a Retina-Tele-Arton f4 / 85mm too but have never used it as the minimum focus distance was just too long for me. And of course the Schneider Curtagon 28mm referred to by Farside. Rodenstock made matching lenses to the Schneiders, all of which we're designed to be interchangeable on the Retina Reflex S and Retina IIIS. I've never tried the Rodenstocks as they are now too expensive. And that might be your biggest problem: present prices are high. I saw a Septon on eBay going for a BIN price of over $375 and the description stated both fungus and separation.
Good luck.


PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 5:27 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

I think all the Septon have separation issues sooner or later.

There are more you can use but these are not for ordinary users as they are either too expensive or rare. I do not include the zoom or any super-tele lens.

Voigtlander Skopagon 2/40 - double-gauss based wide angle with outstanding color and sharpness at its time. Usually has separation issues
Rodenstock 2.8/30, 4/35, 2.8/50, 1.9/50, 4/85, 4/135 - color rendition similar to those Lecia in its time?
Steinheil 4.5/35, 1.9/50 - natural color and good sharpness

There are even some more rare DKL lens in the world but you will need luck and money to buy them so I do not mention them here.


PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:32 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Good catch Calvin, I completely forgot about the Skopagon - I believe Rino liked it a lot. I just looked for those being sold online: pricey!

Do you have samples posted from the Quinon? Edit: just found it: great colours & images.

Last question: why is it that Schneider and Rodenstock lenses cannot interchange (Schneider-body, Rodenstock lens), but they each can work on the same adapter?


Last edited by l9magen on Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:35 am; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:34 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

l9magen wrote:

Last question: why is it that Schneider and Rodenstock lenses cannot interchange (Schneider-body, Rodenstock lens), but they each can work on the same adapter?

They both are DKL mount, but Kodak and Voigtlander chose to put the access notch in a different place in the mount. Easy to file an additional notch to allow cross-compatibility, and the DKL adapter will accept both by design.


PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 11:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Farside - do you have an image of the modification?


PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 1:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For DKL mount SLRs, there are two more models from Kodak that share the same lens mount: the Retina Reflex III and Retina Reflex IV, which is the last one they made. The very first Retina Reflex uses the same concept as Retina IIIc and Retina IIIC, that is a fixed rear lens group behind the shutter and a interchangeable front group. Kodak stated clearly that if the rear group is made by Schneider, the front group has to be made by Schneider as well. Similarly, if the rear group is from Rodenstock, the front group has to be matched by one from Rodenstock. This is the incompatibaility of Retina cameras, no such problem for Retina Reflex S, III and IV. While the current DKL adapters can be used for both Retina Reflex lenses as well as those from Voigtlander for Bassamatic, the only exception I found was the 200mm Tele Xenar for Retina Reflex, the mount is a bit different from all the rest.

Lens separation on cemented group is a common problem for lenses made by Voigtlander, Rodenstock and Carl Zeiss of 1950s and 1960s, much less so for Schneider or Zeiss Jena, also uncommon for Japanese manufacturers, may be they used the wrong glue?


PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 6:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

thanks folks!

sorry for stupid question, is it worth of searching and buying this old dkl lenses and use them on modern slr cameras?

are there any drawbacks beside automatic exposure and autofocus? do they produce same quality output on digital camera as on old slr?

i am little bit in stress what to do Smile

it


PostPosted: Thu Oct 03, 2013 7:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Here's a fairly comprehensive lit of DKL lenses. There are probably more Steinheils, but I don't know what they are. I think Enna also made some DKL lenses.

Steinheil Culmigon 35mm f/4.5
Steinheil Cassarit 50mm f/2.8
Steinheil Culminar 50mm f/2.8
Steinheil Quinon 50mm f/1.9
Schneider-Kreuznach Curtagon 28mm f/4
Schneider-Kreuznach Curtagon 35mm f/2.8
Schneider-Kreuznach Xenar 45mm f/2.8
Schneider-Kreuznach Xenar 50mm f/2.8
Schneider-Kreuznach Xenon 50mm f/1.9
Schneider-Kreuznach Tele-Arton 85mm f/4
Schneider-Kreuznach Tele-Arton 90mm f/4
Schneider-Kreuznach Tele-Xenar 135mm f/4
Schneider-Kreuznach Tele-Xenar 200mm f/4.8
Rodenstock Eurygon 30mm f/2.8
Rodenstock Eurygon 35m f/4
Rodenstock Ysarex 50mm f/2.8
Rodenstock Heligon 50mm f/1.9
Rodenstock Rotelar 85mm f/4
Rodenstock Rotelar 135mm f/4
Voigtlander Skoparet/Skoparex 35mm f/3.4
Voigtlander Skopagon 40mm f/2.0
Voigtlander Color-Skopar-X 50mm f/2.8
Voigtlander Color Lanthar 50mm f/2.8
Voigtlander Septon 50mm f/2
Voigtlander Dynarex 90mm f/3.4
Voigtlander Dynaret/Dynarex 100mm f/4.8
Voigtlander Super-Dynaret/Dynarex 135mm f/4
Voigtlander Super Dynarex 200mm f/4.0
Voigtlander Super Dynarex 350mm f/5.6
Voigtlander Zoomar 3682mm f/2.8


PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2013 12:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

l9magen wrote:
Thanks Farside - do you have an image of the modification?

Rick Oleson's site to the rescue...
http://rick_oleson.tripod.com/index-150.html
Examining mine - it's a simple five-minute Dremel job. Before the Dremel it would have been a bit of a pita, but do-able.

romans001 wrote:
sorry for stupid question, is it worth of searching and buying this old dkl lenses and use them on modern slr cameras?

are there any drawbacks beside automatic exposure and autofocus? do they produce same quality output on digital camera as on old slr?

The quality's good. Nice colour rendition.


PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2013 2:38 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

romans001 wrote:
thanks folks!

sorry for stupid question, is it worth of searching and buying this old dkl lenses and use them on modern slr cameras?

are there any drawbacks beside automatic exposure and autofocus? do they produce same quality output on digital camera as on old slr?

i am little bit in stress what to do Smile

it



I think playing with DKL lenses are great fun. Very Happy They are mostly cute, small and light. The drawbacks are the generally long MFD and the adapter is thick and ugly compared to the lenses.


PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2013 4:00 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

The list from Ian is nearly cover all except the following few rare lenses:

Wittnauer Chronostar Coated 50mm f/2.8 - a re-branded lens, not sure who is the marker. It is certain that it made in W.Germany.

Vemar Telephoto 135 f/4 - the only one Made in Japan lens for Retina Reflex

Schneider Braun-Radiogon 35mm f/4 - rare early wide angle , not as good as the later Curtagon

Staeble BRAUN-Reflex-Ultralit 50mm f/2.8 - very rare, good color from the samples i have see

Enna BRAUN-Reflex-Litnagon 35mm f/3.5 - very rare, usually it is bundle with a Quinon together for sell

Care Zeiss Planar 50mm f/2 - prototype only

Care Zeiss Tessar 50mm f/2.8 - prototype only


Later lens form Schneider and Voigtlander will have slightly shorter 0.6M MFD. Some of the Voigtlander even goes closer:

Voigtlander Skoparex 35/3.4 0.4M
Voigtlander Skopagon 40/2 0.5M


This should be a rather complete list of the DKL lenses. Some of the variation have not included.


PostPosted: Fri Oct 04, 2013 4:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Ian,

I think the Dynaret or Super Dynaret you mentioned on lenses supplied by Voigtlander are for Voigtlander Vitessa T, a rangefinder camera. They look quite similar to Dynarex or Super Dynarex, but with their own aperture ring, there are adapters available to use theses Vitessa T lenses on SLR cameras. As such, I believe Vitessa T is not using DKL mount, although they look so similar...