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helios 44M-7
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PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 8:04 am    Post subject: helios 44M-7 Reply with quote




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PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 12:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like 1 Like 1

Is it real 44M-7 or rebadged 44M as usual?


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 1:23 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Like 1


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 1:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alex TG wrote:
Like 1 Like 1

Is it real 44M-7 or rebadged 44M as usual?



Ohhhh.

?????????


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 4:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alex TG wrote:
Like 1 Like 1

Is it real 44M-7 or rebadged 44M as usual?

With Helios, you can never be sure anyway. The plastic rings are easily exchangeable.
Sell your 44M-4 as 44M-7, and go on using 44M-7 with an inferior ring.
Likely happened more than once.

Failing that...
I'm going to bet I can exchange complete optical cores between two 44M-X in under 10 minutes.
And someone who did this several times will be done well within five.

So don't leave me with your Helios in the room while going to the bathroom: by the time you have returned everything will be the same outside, including serial and dings, but the optical core might be a bit different from the one you've had before Smile


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 4:10 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

papasito wrote:

Ohhhh.

?????????

Like 99% of 44M-7 Helioses are just fakes. Most of them are just 44M with 44M-7 name rings. They can be easily distinguished just by the appearance (non-shrouded distance scale, A/M switch, 8 blades and so on).


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 4:20 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidaho wrote:

Sell your 44M-4 as 44M-7, and go on using 44M-7 with an inferior ring.
Likely happened more than once.

Somehow 44M-4/5/6s with 44M-7 rings are quite rare, which is just astonishing to me Very Happy


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alex TG wrote:

Somehow 44M-4/5/6s with 44M-7 rings are quite rare, which is just astonishing to me Very Happy

How can you tell a 44M-4 with 44M-7 ring from a true 44M-7 though?


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 5:16 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidaho wrote:
How can you tell a 44M-4 with 44M-7 ring from a true 44M-7 though?

I can't, at least visually.
I just meant that almost every time I see 44M-7, it is clearly made of 44M.
Which is funny 'cause it is more logical to make them of plentiful and non-distinguishable 44M-4.
But no, every time it is "ultra-rare experimental 8-bladed Helios 44M-7"...


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 6:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Alex TG wrote:

Which is funny 'cause it is more logical to make them of plentiful and non-distinguishable 44M-4.

Yes, and this is the point I'm trying to make: there probably a lot of those non-distinguishable 44M-4s around, we just can't tell.
As you've pointed out, the 44M route requires more work and produces identifiable fake.
This makes me think: easier and more successful ring swap between 44M-X lenses takes place several times more often than 44M mod.

This is why I think that
aidaho wrote:
With Helios, you can never be sure anyway.


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 6:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The best way to get a real Helios 44M-7, is to avoid ebay and source a Zenit 122 locally.
At least in my country there are plenty of them.

Same goes for ebay, avoiding buying the lens by itself, specially the expensive ones with boxes that look brand new.
Buy a Zenit 122 with the papers from a private seller, they have the serials (body and lens). Compare both and make sure they are late serials.


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 7:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cracking performance all the same from this lens.
Really good images, and the Bokeh is well used, I have 5 Helios 44's including a 7 as well

Serial number starts with 93
I guess that this could be on original?
Condition is as new


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 8:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Which is the s/n of the real 44 M-7?


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 8:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

eddieitman wrote:
Serial number starts with 93
I guess that this could be on original?

Could be. Could also be 44M-6 with the 44M-7 nameplate. Could even be 44M-5 (I don't know exactly when the production stopped, but it was late 80s or early 90s).


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 11:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

papasito wrote:
Which is the s/n of the real 44 M-7?


They were all produced at the same time (M-5, M-6, M-7), at least for some time. There are even late serials Helios 44-2 with the modern barrel.
Since the nameplate is so easy to swap there is really no way to know these days with evilbay.

A trusted seller and a serial from 92 onwards will most probably be the real thing.


Last edited by littleearth on Wed May 27, 2020 11:25 pm; edited 2 times in total


PostPosted: Wed May 27, 2020 11:24 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Take a good look at the lettering of the name ring. They are using fake name rings that don't look as good as original ones (It wouldn't make sense to use a real m7 name ring because you would have to cannibalize a real m7 for it :p.


PostPosted: Thu May 28, 2020 7:05 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thank you everyone,I really can't know whether it's true or not,I have some pictures of it


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PostPosted: Thu May 28, 2020 8:18 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

tachi wrote:
Thank you everyone,I really can't know whether it's true or not,I have some pictures of it

It's a bit odd looking to me.

Plastic ring is consistent with 1995, but the non-blackened aperture is not.
44M-X v1 from the late 1992 onward had an optical block with properly black aperture.
44M-X v2, which was a later version, indeed reverted back to a cheap shiny one.

Was there ever a late 1993+ 44M-X v1 with shiny aperture?
I don't know. It's possible. I've never seen it before. Could be a transitional model between v1 and v2.

If this is an optical block swap, it has to be swapped from pre-1992 44M-X v1, since the one from v2 had slightly different build.

TL;DR: I don't know. Anything is possible in Helios wonderland.


PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:14 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

What do you think about this one?


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PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 1:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

It has a rubber grip. Pretty rare I'd say. What's the first two letters of the serial number?


PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 2:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

D1N0 wrote:
It has a rubber grip. Pretty rare I'd say. What's the first two letters of the serial number?


It is a lens that I once had but didn't like the feel. I sold it. I only have the two pictures and one partially shows the serial number, but not very clear. I enhance it some and guess that it might be 95 or 96. Do those years make sense?


PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 3:58 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

woodrim wrote:
D1N0 wrote:
It has a rubber grip. Pretty rare I'd say. What's the first two letters of the serial number?


It is a lens that I once had but didn't like the feel. I sold it. I only have the two pictures and one partially shows the serial number, but not very clear. I enhance it some and guess that it might be 95 or 96. Do those years make sense?


It would. Later dates would make it far less likely it is a fake. There is a dpreview topic about this https://www.dpreview.com/forums/post/58931210 Right now I can't find any rubber grip m-7's on Ebay. I guess not very many were made.


PostPosted: Mon Jun 08, 2020 6:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

D1N0 wrote:
It has a rubber grip. Pretty rare I'd say. What's the first two letters of the serial number?

It does not have a rubber grip, it's all metal except the face plate. Source: holding one in my hand.
This is the second iteration of 44M-X line and there are indeed not that much of them around.

Internally it's a cheaper build than it's heavily popularized older brother. This directly contributes to around 30g of weight savings.
All in all I have nothing against it, but in v2 manufacturer reverted to non-blackened aperture, which is a bummer.

Optically I could not find any differences.







PostPosted: Thu Jun 11, 2020 3:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Those are some very fresh photos. Interesting, sharp, bokeh is great. Great to watch. Thanks for posting. Took my 44m-4 immediately to rain to take some photos. Can't believe how good this lens is at f2.


PostPosted: Mon Jun 15, 2020 9:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

aidaho wrote:
D1N0 wrote:
It has a rubber grip. Pretty rare I'd say. What's the first two letters of the serial number?

It does not have a rubber grip, it's all metal except the face plate. Source: holding one in my hand.
This is the second iteration of 44M-X line and there are indeed not that much of them around.

Internally it's a cheaper build than it's heavily popularized older brother. This directly contributes to around 30g of weight savings.
All in all I have nothing against it, but in v2 manufacturer reverted to non-blackened aperture, which is a bummer.

Optically I could not find any differences.


I have a 44M-7(?) that looks exactly as the 44M-6 in your picture (left), serial 96xxx. Does that mean that I have a fake M-7? aka an M-6 with a changed name ring? M-6 versus M-7 have a different resolving power, no?