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Fujinon EBC 50mm 1.4 - Any problems through airport security
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PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 12:23 pm    Post subject: Fujinon EBC 50mm 1.4 - Any problems through airport security Reply with quote

I just got one of these sweet lil Fujinon 50mm EBC 1.4s and read quite a bit about it having radioactive coatings. And on one (not so mainstream) board it was apparently 'hotter' than all the Takumars.

Now, I'm not paranoid or anything - just wanted to know whether anyone has had any problems taking this lens or a similar one through European airport security. Germany, to be specific.

I'm traveling for work and don't want this to get in the way or worst case, end up being flagged or something for carrying radioactive sh1t.

Its yellowed quite a bit.

Anyone anyone?




Last edited by an33sh on Mon May 16, 2011 12:39 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 12:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

I've never seen anyone checking for radioactivity on airports.

Besides, Thorium is an alpha emitter. Wrap it in paper and all radiation is blocked.


PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 12:38 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cistron wrote:
I've never seen anyone checking for radioactivity on airports.

Besides, Thorium is an alpha emitter. Wrap it in paper and all radiation is blocked.


Ah. I'm no expert in these areas so thought its better to ask.

Thanks for the prompt reply!


PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 1:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Where have you heard about the EBC Fujinon 50mm f/1.4 being radioactive? Mine definitely isn't, nor is the 55mm f/1.8 EBC Fujinon or 55mm f/1.6 Fujinon. (A significant number of other focal lengths in the Fujinon range are radioactive, but curiously the normal lenses, unlike their Takumar equivalents, aren't.)

If someone can prove that they have a radioactive 50mm f/1.4 EBC Fujinon, I'd be extremely interested. Can you give me a link to the board where you heard this reported?


Last edited by Arkku on Mon May 16, 2011 2:49 pm; edited 2 times in total


PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 1:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Cistron wrote:

Besides, Thorium is an alpha emitter. Wrap it in paper and all radiation is blocked.


Completely untrue.


PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 1:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

As for the airport question, I have travelled with the 58mm f/1.2 Rokkor which has huge elements and measures the most radioactive of all my lenses, never a problem at airports. Theoretically it would be easily detectable through a camera bag but not from any great distance, so the radiation detector would need to be applied directly to your bag.

But, as I said above, at least my EBC 50mm f/1.4 isn't radioactive.


PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 1:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arkku wrote:
Completely untrue.
Missed the bit about gamma radiation, although it is only listed as accompanying.

Any idea how it compares genuine gamma emitters?


PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 3:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arkku wrote:
As for the airport question, I have travelled with the 58mm f/1.2 Rokkor which has huge elements and measures the most radioactive of all my lenses, never a problem at airports. Theoretically it would be easily detectable through a camera bag but not from any great distance, so the radiation detector would need to be applied directly to your bag.

But, as I said above, at least my EBC 50mm f/1.4 isn't radioactive.


Just to keep in mind, I dunno how legit or knowledgeable this forum is -

http://cameracollector.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=vslrs&action=display&thread=4077&page=1


PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 3:09 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arkku wrote:
As for the airport question, I have travelled with the 58mm f/1.2 Rokkor which has huge elements and measures the most radioactive of all my lenses, never a problem at airports. Theoretically it would be easily detectable through a camera bag but not from any great distance, so the radiation detector would need to be applied directly to your bag.

But, as I said above, at least my EBC 50mm f/1.4 isn't radioactive.


Oh alright. Sounds like reason enough to believe it will clear security.


PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 7:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

an33sh wrote:

Just to keep in mind, I dunno how legit or knowledgeable this forum is -

http://cameracollector.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=vslrs&action=display&thread=4077&page=1


Very interesting, it seems like that one person has actually measured the lens as radioactive. This would clearly indicate that there are multiple versions of the 50mm f/1.4, since I've measured mine non-radioactive. Curiously my older, non-EBC 50mm f/1.4 is also not radioactive.

So, if anyone has a yellowed Fujinon 50mm f/1.4 that they suspect is radioactive, please sell it to me! =)


PostPosted: Mon May 16, 2011 9:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hi,

an33sh wrote:
I'm traveling for work and don't want this to get in the way or worst case, end up being flagged or something for carrying radioactive sh1t.


Most of the people traveling with old fluorescent wrist watches are carrying radioactive (tritium) stuff ...

I have traveled from France to Germany, Italy and USA with my Takumars and i have been asked to open my backpack only once, because one of the customs agents was an amateur photograph and wanted to look at my Taks Twisted Evil ...

Moreover, a yellowed front lens doesn't mean that the lens is radioactive. Have you seen a lens coming from a smokers house ?

Don't worry more than this and enjoy your trip ...


PostPosted: Tue May 17, 2011 1:21 pm    Post subject: Re: Fujinon EBC 50mm 1.4 - Any problems through airport secu Reply with quote

an33sh wrote:
I just got one of these sweet lil Fujinon 50mm EBC 1.4s and read quite a bit about it having radioactive coatings.


It's never the coatings that are radioactive. One or more of the lens elements may contain Thorium. If that is the case, usually it will be easily detected by eye because the lens will display yellowing. Presumably pretty much all lenses with thoriated elements will have elements that are cemented together with Canada balsam, which turns yellow (or even brown) over time because of the radiation.


PostPosted: Sun Jul 24, 2011 7:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

It's not the balsam that radioactive thoriated glass turns yellow -- it's the glass itslef. Glass itself turns yellow to brown when irradiated. CERN's accelerators can't use fiber optic cables anywhere that there's radiation for this reason.


PostPosted: Mon Jul 25, 2011 11:37 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arkku wrote:
Curiously my older, non-EBC 50mm f/1.4 is also not radioactive.


I am glad to hear that. Mine non-EBC is the most dark yellowed of all, even Takumars. I was sure it's glowing. But then again it's not only yellow it's also purple. I like it!


PostPosted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:08 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Arkku wrote:
Where have you heard about the EBC Fujinon 50mm f/1.4 being radioactive? Mine definitely isn't, nor is the 55mm f/1.8 EBC Fujinon or 55mm f/1.6 Fujinon. (A significant number of other focal lengths in the Fujinon range are radioactive, but curiously the normal lenses, unlike their Takumar �equivalents�, aren't.)

If someone can prove that they have a radioactive 50mm f/1.4 EBC Fujinon, I'd be extremely interested. Can you give me a link to the board where you heard this reported?


Hi Arkku,

I remember your posts of EBC Fujinon's radioactivity on other forums. I have never heard of anyone having a radioactive EBC Fujinon 28/3.5 before. However, mine has a yellowed rear element. Please see the images below. Have you come across any Fujinon 28/3.5 being radioactive? Or, is that yellowing something else, do you think? The rear elements on my EBC 55/1.8 and EBC 135/3.5 do not show such yellow colors.

Thanks!




[/img]


PostPosted: Tue Jan 23, 2018 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

hanhasgotqi wrote:
I have never heard of anyone having a radioactive EBC Fujinon 28/3.5 before. However, mine has a yellowed rear element. Please see the images below.
The yellow coating/reflection color has nothing to do with radioactivity.

You can test a lens by holding it in front of a sheet of white paper. Looking through the lens will show you how the glass affects the colors. When the sheet's color gets altered to yellow, you have a yellowed lens. Simple stuff.

To make sure a lens is really 'hot' you have to measure it with a radioactivity counter.


PostPosted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 2:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes to what y said above, you have to look through the lens, not it's reflection.

Nice to see confusion dominates the subject.
I've never heard of anyone being stopped for a radioactive lens

The only thing I could find is this: http://www.nti.org/analysis/articles/russia-radioactive-lens-detected-chelyabinsk-airport/
Quote:
On 18 January 2010, a passenger's luggage triggered a radiation alarm at the Chelyabinsk airport. The source of radiation was found to be a photo camera lens. The dose rate exceeded the background by 20 times. It is assumed that the lens contained Th-232.

Abstract Number: 20101014
Headline: Russia: Radioactive Lens Detected at Chelyabinsk Airport
Date: 18 January 2010
Bibliography: "В аэропорту Челябинска Изъять радиоактивный фотообъектив [At the Chelyabinsk airport, a radioactive photographic lense was confiscated]," UralInform Byuro, 21 January 2010, via www.uralinform.ru


PostPosted: Wed Jan 24, 2018 4:15 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Even the lens has the EBC mark, it does not mean all the element surface are multi-coated. Wink


PostPosted: Thu Jan 25, 2018 12:30 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Welcome hanhasgotqi

Interesting handle! Han has got qi


PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:03 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

y wrote:
hanhasgotqi wrote:
I have never heard of anyone having a radioactive EBC Fujinon 28/3.5 before. However, mine has a yellowed rear element. Please see the images below.
The yellow coating/reflection color has nothing to do with radioactivity.

You can test a lens by holding it in front of a sheet of white paper. Looking through the lens will show you how the glass affects the colors. When the sheet's color gets altered to yellow, you have a yellowed lens. Simple stuff.

To make sure a lens is really 'hot' you have to measure it with a radioactivity counter.


Thanks. I just checked my copy of the Fujinon EBC 28/3.5 with a Terra-P geiger counter and it is not radioactive.


PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:24 am    Post subject: Reply with quote

Lightshow wrote:

Nice to see confusion dominates the subject.
I've never heard of anyone being stopped for a radioactive lens


That's quite easily explained: It's not foreseen to check passengers or their luggage for radioactive radiation. If my memory serves me right, Russia did that as the only country on earth although I don't know if they still do that.

FYI I've been active in this industry for several decades and have been responsible for international aviation safety and security as well. Wink


PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:48 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

A member of the Facebook Group, Photography With Classic lenses had their shipment stopped due to it failing a radiation check. The lens was a 50/1.4 super Tak being sent via ebay's Global Shipping Programme from the US to Canada.


PostPosted: Mon Feb 12, 2018 5:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

itsfozzy wrote:
A member of the Facebook Group, Photography With Classic lenses had their shipment stopped due to it failing a radiation check. The lens was a 50/1.4 super Tak being sent via ebay's Global Shipping Programme from the US to Canada.


Well, that's indeed interesting as we speak here about transportation of cargo.

For cargo the international laws are as follows:

It's purely the shippers responsibility and liability to declare dangerous goods and to adhere to e.g. the ICAO laws (if it's air cargo) for the definition of dangerous goods. If in doubt, the shipper has to sign a shipper's declaration for non-dangerous goods. There is a certain level of radiation measured outside the surface of the package which makes the difference and there are certain goods irrespective of radiation as well. Camera lenses do not belong to the listed goods. Generally it's allowed to ship radioactive goods as long as they are well declared and proper packed according to the laws; i.e. there is no reason to deny the acceptance of radioactive goods for transportation.

However, every transportation company or airline is free to do some additional checks on their own but nobody is forced by law to do that, not even in the U.S or Canada. Otherwise I would know as the airline I was working for used to have regular scheduled flights to these countries. We definitely didn't measure anything at cargo or luggage acceptance. However, sometimes we undertook some random checks at our home base just out of curiosity, particularly to check the proper package of known radioactive goods, but never ever for camera lenses or even wrist watches, which happened to be radioactive as well some years ago.

To deny the transportation of a single Super Takumar lens is simply crazy and nothing else.


PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:03 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

indianadinos wrote:
Hi,

an33sh wrote:
I'm traveling for work and don't want this to get in the way or worst case, end up being flagged or something for carrying radioactive sh1t.


Most of the people traveling with old fluorescent wrist watches are carrying radioactive (tritium) stuff ...


Well, the probable explanation is that tritium is low energy beta, and therefore can't be easily detected with normal equipment.
Some decay products of the Thorium decay chain are naturally not just alpha emitter and as far as I know (hearsay) big airports do have dosimeters/detectors to pick up radiation if someone tries to smuggle material.
If you are getting close enough to a detector, it might pick up something. E.g. the almost 40 µSv/h at back of my Porst 1.2/55 mm.
See: http://www.digicamclub.de/showthread.php?t=13351&page=5&p=216839&viewfull=1#post216839
There is increased activity detectable within almost a meter, so if one is unlucky, you might get in trouble like the guy in Russia. I have flown a few times within Europe, always from German airports, carrying the Porst 1.2/55 mm and never had issues, but I now leave it mostly at home, also because my Minolta 1.2/50 is better... Wink
So just make sure that it is not too hot, as compared to background. I would then not expect any trouble.


PostPosted: Tue Feb 13, 2018 3:19 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

My own radioactive lens, an Aero Ektar 610mm f6, is a significant gamma ray source. However, based on you-tube videos I have seen, if you back the probe away several feet, even from that much larger lens, the gamma ray count falls to where it is close to background.

So I suspect the distance between probe and lens will be important as regards any possible detection and AA (adverse action).