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20/21 mm shoot out
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PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 2:59 pm    Post subject: 20/21 mm shoot out Reply with quote

It is rainy in Toronto, so the subject is a boring scene. Camera used is EOS
5D with ISO 320, AE-mode. Raw developer is Caputure one V4.8 with
Auto exposure, light level, but no USM. Manfrotto tripod 055 was used with a shoe-mount level.

Format is 1) whole scene, 2) left lower corner 100%, 3) center right 100%,
three shots for each lens. All are shot at F2.8 except ML21 with F3.5.

1) Carl Zeiss Distagon T* 2.8/21 ZF @f2.8




2) Olympus Zuiko 21/2 @f2.8




3) Yashica ML 21/3.5 @f3.5




4) CZJ FLektogon 20/2.8 @f2.8




5) Ai Nikkor 20/2.8S @f2.8




The right side of Distagon 21mm is a bit fazzier due to Fotodiox adapter, I re-shot @f5.6 which
was better than the others. The left side of Zuiko 21mm too is fazzier, but not sure whether
it is due to an adapter or not. Anyway do not take this TOO seriouesly. Very Happy
It is a peril of comparison shooting....

Somehow adapters are not identical for these lenses, the test shots are not too scientific nor
enjoyable to do. Crying or Very sad When the weather gets better I will go out and shoot them hopefully.

New sample shots by DIstagon 21mm ZF are here > http://www.pbase.com/kkawakami/carlzeissdist2128zf


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 3:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks for this interesting test!

The Zeiss 2.8/21 seems to be the clear winner in my eyes.
But the Nikkor and (surprise?) the Yashica live up to it pretty well.

I am a little disappointed by the performance of the Zuiko. Shocked


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LucisPictor wrote:
Thanks for this interesting test!

The Zeiss 2.8/21 seems to be the clear winner in my eyes.
But the Nikkor and (surprise?) the Yashica live up to it pretty well.

I am a little disappointed by the performance of the Zuiko. Shocked


+1


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 4:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Thanks Koji for the lens test.
I love shooting with my Yashica ML 21.
Now I see that it was worth buying it and not waiting for the Distagon.
I got my ML 21 for 1/8 th of the price of the Zeiss.

You make my day happy

Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy Very Happy


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 4:13 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

LucisPictor, do not conclude the final yet. My adapter for OM->EF might
have uneven thickness, someone mentioned it. I will use an another
adapter, unfortunately the same make!!

Sharpness-wise D21ZF is a winner, colour rendition is pure Zeiss too.
Yes Yashica ML21/3.5 is a not bad lens at all, I kinda like Ai20/2.8S
personally, they all have wavy distortion. Distagon is least light falloff
to me.


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 4:21 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yashica two thumbs up, for IQ and for lack of distortion

Nikkor one thumb up for IQ, distortion seems bad though

Flek 2.8 hmm.... so and so, but overall worse than Nikkor

Zuiko looks terrible Sad

Does your Distagon 21 ZF make the corners cyan coloured as I have read on some forums?


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 4:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

For me, it's
1. Yashica
2. Distagon
3. Flektogon
4. Nkkor
5. Olympus


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 4:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Zuiko is not right i agree Koji.
Mine that I wish I did not sell Crying or Very sad was cracking sharp and performed exquisitely.
The surprise here is the ML21. I really think that lens is a bargain. Although good luck to find one Wink

Can you shoot the D21 native on the Nikon FF?


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 4:37 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Orio, I have not noticed the corner Cyanization yet. Some of shots including
sky had slight colour shift, but I did not object it at all. Actually I was expecting
to get cyan corners, but it is not noticeable to me YET.

When the truly bad cyan corder comes, there is always a rescue
available. Its name is "CornerFix" developed for M8's infamous
cyan corner problem with UV-IR cut filters. This free soft requires
.DNG file to do corner fixing, so I did experimented already. Using .NEF
and Adobe's DNG converter, I obtained D700's .DNG file first. Then
raw developer C1 (capture one) to make .dng file to .jpg/.tiff.

It works, I can even use D700 profile for C1 program. Only problem is
I have to set this profile to every raw files, but DNG default profile too
works reasonably well. I do not know other raw developers except
PS's default one, which I do not like much. The below is a quick and dirty
shot at F16, upper left corner has darkening (might be cyan corder), though
lower corners aren't I guess.



PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 4:40 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Yes, Andy. Zuiko is much better then these shots I think.

For Nikon native shots, see my hope page's D21 page. >
http://www.pbase.com/kkawakami/carlzeissdist2128zf

Please pick "original" size (mine are all ~1200 x 1800).

I will try Zuiko 21mm again for the sake of ZUIKO. Very Happy


Last edited by koji on Thu May 14, 2009 4:45 pm; edited 1 time in total


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 4:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Zuiko can't be that bad, right.

I agree with Hassan's list. The ML did surprising well. And yes, I agree with Andy, that yashica looks like one of the hidden gems. The Yashica ML lines are very good, at least from what I have seen on the web. They are not regularly available on the 'bay, though.


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 5:02 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

bawang wrote:
The Zuiko can't be that bad, right.

I agree with Hassan's list. The ML did surprising well. And yes, I agree with Andy, that yashica looks like one of the hidden gems. The Yashica ML lines are very good, at least from what I have seen on the web. They are not regularly available on the 'bay, though.


My ML 2.8/24 performs near to the quality level of my Distagon 25.


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 5:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Orio wrote:
bawang wrote:
The Zuiko can't be that bad, right.

I agree with Hassan's list. The ML did surprising well. And yes, I agree with Andy, that yashica looks like one of the hidden gems. The Yashica ML lines are very good, at least from what I have seen on the web. They are not regularly available on the 'bay, though.


My ML 2.8/24 performs near to the quality level of my Distagon 25.


I agree and I have an Rare M42 version in the Marketplace that I am shocked nobody has taken yet. Sad It will be a shame to let it leave the group if it goes to ebay.


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 6:17 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

@ koji
Before I picked up my ML 21 half year ago, I was looking at your site at your Yashica examples and I was impressed by the quality.

Rolling Eyes

... and for aquiring my ML 24 and ML 28 you are guilty, too

Evil or Very Mad


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 6:22 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Hahaha, that is my mission. Very Happy


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

... and your Macro ML 100/3.5 test has put me into some sleepless nights.
Sad

So keep on testing - always a pleasure to see your tests.

Wink


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 6:50 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

The Distagon is the winner...but the price of this lens... Rolling Eyes



One surprise, the Yashica...and the Nikkor.


However, the Flek looks good (in this samples, much better than the Zuiko...), and you can get one arround 350$.



Regards


PostPosted: Thu May 14, 2009 7:45 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Of these, I have the 21/3.5 ML and the 20/2.8 Flek, and these results agree with my own anecdotal experience in ranking the pair. What is remarkable is how well the ML performs against the Distagon ; that has surprised me agreeably, considering what I paid for the Yashica. Whilst it's unrealistic to expect to make a considered comparison on the basis of web-quality reproductions, the ML has the performance edge to my eye over the Distagon.

I let my acquisition of the ML 24mm dissuade me from looking further for the 25mm Distagon, and I see from the comments of others here that I was dissuaded in the right direction. The 24mm ML cost me a tenth of what I've seen the 25mm CZ lens attract.

I don't want to make anyone grind their teeth who may have paid more, but my 20mm Flek cost the equivalent of about $100.


PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 5:18 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

koji, I didnt know there was a Yashica 21, now Im looking.


PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 5:43 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Bruce wrote:
koji, I didnt know there was a Yashica 21, now Im looking.


Good luck. I am looking for almost two years and still haven't found one at decent price. There are some on Ebay for sale by an American seller who has evidently gotten a bunch of them and has now "cornered the market", so to say, and asks high prices (not just for this lens, for many mf lenses)


PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 6:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Conax/Yashica speciality shop in Tokyo has two,
A- 79,800 Yen
AB- 46,800 yen (front element has small coating off)

This shop has five 85/1.2s in stock!


PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 7:49 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

Orio wrote:
There are some on Ebay for sale by an American seller who has evidently gotten a bunch of them and has now "cornered the market", so to say, and asks high prices (not just for this lens, for many mf lenses)

Well of course.... Go-k Laughing
He must be reading these posts religiously $$$


PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 8:26 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

koji wrote:
Conax/Yashica speciality shop in Tokyo has two,
A- 79,800 Yen
AB- 46,800 yen (front element has small coating off)

This shop has five 85/1.2s in stock!


Huh that's amazing!
I had mine in the marketplace here last year for $350 with no takers. Then went to Ebay sold on action for ..............$350 exactly Laughing

Second thought maybe it was BIN does not matter it was $350 Laughing

Andy, you have gotton a good deal. These prices seem to go up to me, though I paid
US$500 two years ago at ePay. Very Happy (I had to have one as meat of my ML collection! :8 )


PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 9:31 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

F16SUNSHINE wrote:

I had mine in the marketplace here last year for $350 with no takers.


Shocked Shocked
Either I was in a moment without money, or I was blind! Evil or Very Mad


PostPosted: Fri May 15, 2009 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote

koji wrote:

This shop has five 85/1.2s in stock!


Shocked
out of curiosity... what price they ask?