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LucisPictor
Joined: 26 Feb 2007 Posts: 17633 Location: Oberhessen, Germany / Maidstone ('95-'96)
Expire: 2013-12-03
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Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 7:31 pm Post subject: |
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LucisPictor wrote:
This is nothing but a fun test ... fun for me.
That's why I carry through comparisons like this one.
It's fun (and I wanted to play with Weebly.com). _________________ Personal forum activity on pause every now and again (due to job obligations)!
Carsten, former Moderator
Things ON SALE
Carsten = "KAPCTEH" = "Karusutenu" | T-shirt?.........................My photos from Emilia: http://www.schouler.net/emilia/emilia2011.html
My gear: http://retrocameracs.wordpress.com/ausrustung/
Old list: http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=65 (Not up-to-date, sorry!) | http://www.lucispictor.de | http://www.alensaweek.wordpress.com |
http://www.retrocamera.de |
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Bruce
Joined: 15 Jan 2008 Posts: 842 Location: Boston, Ma USA
Expire: 2014-11-22
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Posted: Sat Nov 14, 2009 10:02 pm Post subject: |
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Bruce wrote:
cooltouch wrote: |
I suspect the performance of the other three lenses is quite a bit better than that shown, especially the Hassy's. Those images almost look as if there was camera shake. The tester should have locked up the Hassy's mirror. |
I am thinking the same thing, camera shake, but I have found other comments, on the web, about "this" test, that the Hassy image has "coma". Im thinking now this shake might be coma in the Hassy image. _________________ Digital: Canon 40d & 5DmkII, Film: Hasselblad 203fe/Zeiss 80/2.8 cfe
Adapters for EOS: Cy; M42; Zenit39; Exakta; LeicaR; OlympusOM; PK; Nikon; Rollei35; Retina; Adaptal; P-6 |
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tuananhmap
Joined: 18 Aug 2009 Posts: 130
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 1:50 am Post subject: |
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tuananhmap wrote:
100mm f2 planar, I bough it yesterday
sample at f2, f4, f5.6
http://cid-7ed3a22b5b1e160b.skydrive.live.com/browse.aspx/street?uc=3 |
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cooltouch
Joined: 15 Jan 2009 Posts: 9097 Location: Houston, Texas
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Orio
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 29545 Location: West Emilia
Expire: 2012-12-04
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 9:35 am Post subject: |
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Orio wrote:
If the Nikkor AI is a Xenotar, then it's basically a Biometar lens.
Xenotar and Biometar are identical:
Xenotar:
Biometar:
Biometar and Xenotar are somehow "hybrids" between Planar and Sonnar. _________________ Orio, Administrator
T*
NE CEDE MALIS AUDENTIOR ITO
Ferrania film is reborn! http://www.filmferrania.it/
Support the Ornano film chemicals company and help them survive!
http://forum.mflenses.com/ornano-chemical-products-t55525.html |
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LucisPictor
Joined: 26 Feb 2007 Posts: 17633 Location: Oberhessen, Germany / Maidstone ('95-'96)
Expire: 2013-12-03
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:19 am Post subject: |
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LucisPictor wrote:
Historically, the Biometer is an altered version of the Biotar.
The cemented element behind the diaphragm has been replaced by a meniscus. Thus the Biometar is a mixture between the classic Biotar and a Topogon design and combines the advantages of both ideas: fast lenses and wide angles.
(Source: Hartmut Thiele: Carl Zeiss Jena, Entwicklung und Beschreibung der Photoobjektive und ihre Erfinder. München 2007) _________________ Personal forum activity on pause every now and again (due to job obligations)!
Carsten, former Moderator
Things ON SALE
Carsten = "KAPCTEH" = "Karusutenu" | T-shirt?.........................My photos from Emilia: http://www.schouler.net/emilia/emilia2011.html
My gear: http://retrocameracs.wordpress.com/ausrustung/
Old list: http://forum.mflenses.com/viewtopic.php?t=65 (Not up-to-date, sorry!) | http://www.lucispictor.de | http://www.alensaweek.wordpress.com |
http://www.retrocamera.de |
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Orio
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 29545 Location: West Emilia
Expire: 2012-12-04
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 10:42 am Post subject: |
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Orio wrote:
LucisPictor wrote: |
Historically, the Biometer is an altered version of the Biotar.
The cemented element behind the diaphragm has been replaced by a meniscus. Thus the Biometar is a mixture between the classic Biotar and a Topogon design and combines the advantages of both ideas: fast lenses and wide angles.
(Source: Hartmut Thiele: Carl Zeiss Jena, Entwicklung und Beschreibung der Photoobjektive und ihre Erfinder. München 2007) |
But Biometar is a normal/short tele lens. I don't recall ever seeing a wide angle Biometar. _________________ Orio, Administrator
T*
NE CEDE MALIS AUDENTIOR ITO
Ferrania film is reborn! http://www.filmferrania.it/
Support the Ornano film chemicals company and help them survive!
http://forum.mflenses.com/ornano-chemical-products-t55525.html |
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sichko
Joined: 20 Jun 2008 Posts: 2475 Location: South West UK
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 11:13 am Post subject: |
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sichko wrote:
Orio wrote: |
If the Nikkor AI is a Xenotar, then it's basically a Biometar lens.
Xenotar and Biometar are identical:
.....
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The Nikon site provides a glossary. The Xenotar is described as....
..... "Xenotar 80mm f/2.8", was first released in 1954 .... standard lens for medium-size film format cameras by a German manufacturer, Schnider.
This lens is a modified version of a Gaussian (Gauss-type) lens...
There was also a lens called "Biometar" which was released around the same time by another German manufacturer, Carl Zeiss Jena.
It's interesting that Nikon chose to describe their lens as a Xenotar rather than a Biometar. Also they don't give the date of the Biometar design which may predate the Xenotar. And there are suggestions that at least some of the early Xenotars offered by Schneider were in fact rebadged Biometars manufactured by Carl Ziess Jena. Of course Schneider and CZJ came from different parts of Germany...... _________________ John |
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Carlsson
Joined: 26 Jul 2008 Posts: 793 Location: Portugal
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 11:46 am Post subject: |
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Carlsson wrote:
Orio wrote: |
But Biometar is a normal/short tele lens. I don't recall ever seeing a wide angle Biometar. |
Same for me, but yesterday I have found while searching for a wide angle for my Contax III this one here: Click here to see on Ebay _________________
Contax III, Zeiss Ikon ZM, Contax AX, EOS 5D, R-D1
https://mariaeero.com/contax/ |
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Orio
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 29545 Location: West Emilia
Expire: 2012-12-04
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 11:52 am Post subject: |
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Orio wrote:
Carlsson wrote: |
Orio wrote: |
But Biometar is a normal/short tele lens. I don't recall ever seeing a wide angle Biometar. |
Same for me, but yesterday I have found while searching for a wide angle for my Contax III this one here: Click here to see on Ebay |
Hm... it entirely looks like the pre-war Biogon 2.8/35
My guess is it is the same lens (the Biogon) really and CZJ re-christianized it Biometar to avoid the copyright naming issues. _________________ Orio, Administrator
T*
NE CEDE MALIS AUDENTIOR ITO
Ferrania film is reborn! http://www.filmferrania.it/
Support the Ornano film chemicals company and help them survive!
http://forum.mflenses.com/ornano-chemical-products-t55525.html |
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Carlsson
Joined: 26 Jul 2008 Posts: 793 Location: Portugal
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 12:01 pm Post subject: |
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Carlsson wrote:
Yes, it looks indeed like the pre war Biogon. Sounds reasonable to me. _________________
Contax III, Zeiss Ikon ZM, Contax AX, EOS 5D, R-D1
https://mariaeero.com/contax/ |
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scsambrook
Joined: 29 Mar 2009 Posts: 2167 Location: Glasgow Scotland
Expire: 2011-11-18
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 1:25 pm Post subject: |
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scsambrook wrote:
Carlsson wrote: |
Yes, it looks indeed like the pre war Biogon. Sounds reasonable to me. |
I thought the pre-war 35mm f2.8 Biogon had a very large rear element that actually extended beyond the lens mount ... am I confusing it with another lens? Maybe a revised post war version? Have to say I'm no expert on old Contax lenses! _________________ Stephen
Equipment: Pentax DSLR for casual shooting, Lumix G1 and Fuji XE-1 for playing with old lenses, and Leica M8 because I still like the optical rangefinder system. |
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Orio
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 29545 Location: West Emilia
Expire: 2012-12-04
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 1:27 pm Post subject: |
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Orio wrote:
scsambrook wrote: |
I thought the pre-war 35mm f2.8 Biogon had a very large rear element that actually extended beyond the lens mount ... am I confusing it with another lens? Maybe a revised post war version? Have to say I'm no expert on old Contax lenses! |
yes, black metal tube, you can see it in this lens also. _________________ Orio, Administrator
T*
NE CEDE MALIS AUDENTIOR ITO
Ferrania film is reborn! http://www.filmferrania.it/
Support the Ornano film chemicals company and help them survive!
http://forum.mflenses.com/ornano-chemical-products-t55525.html |
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scsambrook
Joined: 29 Mar 2009 Posts: 2167 Location: Glasgow Scotland
Expire: 2011-11-18
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 1:38 pm Post subject: |
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scsambrook wrote:
Orio wrote: |
scsambrook wrote: |
I thought the pre-war 35mm f2.8 Biogon had a very large rear element that actually extended beyond the lens mount ... am I confusing it with another lens? Maybe a revised post war version? Have to say I'm no expert on old Contax lenses! |
yes, black metal tube, you can see it in this lens also. |
Orio - I must be confused - the one I have in mind has the rear glass protruding WAY beyond the mount and very exposed to damage. Or did you mean the one in the eBay pic actually IS a revised post war model?
Maybe my brain is working even slower than usual today - too good an evening yesterday _________________ Stephen
Equipment: Pentax DSLR for casual shooting, Lumix G1 and Fuji XE-1 for playing with old lenses, and Leica M8 because I still like the optical rangefinder system. |
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Orio
Joined: 24 Feb 2007 Posts: 29545 Location: West Emilia
Expire: 2012-12-04
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:35 pm Post subject: |
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Orio wrote:
Well, I'm not 100% sure either - I only have the Jupiter-12 (the soviet clone).
My jupiter-12 looks exactly like this "biometar". _________________ Orio, Administrator
T*
NE CEDE MALIS AUDENTIOR ITO
Ferrania film is reborn! http://www.filmferrania.it/
Support the Ornano film chemicals company and help them survive!
http://forum.mflenses.com/ornano-chemical-products-t55525.html |
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mflex-on
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:47 pm Post subject: |
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mflex-on wrote:
My Jupiter 12 has a much bigger rear lens. |
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scsambrook
Joined: 29 Mar 2009 Posts: 2167 Location: Glasgow Scotland
Expire: 2011-11-18
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Posted: Sun Nov 15, 2009 3:58 pm Post subject: |
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scsambrook wrote:
For what it's worth ... my brain seems to be working a bit better now ...
I used to have the Jupiter 12 in Leica screw and it had the massive rear element which I thought was identical to the pre-war Biogon.
I think that when Zeiss Oberkochen began Contax IIa/IIIa production in the 50s they made a revised Biogon which had a more "usual" rear element. I'm pretty sure about that. I think. Now it might get interesting - is the Biometar in the eBay listing somehow related to the Oberkochen Biogon? Or the other way round? I guess we need a "serious" Contax expert to answer this one. _________________ Stephen
Equipment: Pentax DSLR for casual shooting, Lumix G1 and Fuji XE-1 for playing with old lenses, and Leica M8 because I still like the optical rangefinder system. |
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tuananhmap
Joined: 18 Aug 2009 Posts: 130
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Posted: Mon Nov 16, 2009 1:03 am Post subject: |
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tuananhmap wrote:
cooltouch wrote: |
I get a server error when I click on the above link. |
you counld check again
http://public.blu.livefilestore.com/y1pmX-l3tOkIbT_9xYLRjM4yt0YWt1w9XGvw_Hhz8NwOW3KfSAlgwPM_SmZVsVRn_JdMSBM4R3-1d8EINmUfsGQ9Q/_MG_9772.JPG |
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estudleon
Joined: 15 May 2008 Posts: 3754 Location: Argentina
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Posted: Tue Nov 17, 2009 1:47 pm Post subject: |
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estudleon wrote:
I continued in the search of the schame of the 2,5/105 nikon lens.
1-The total view of the schame, remind clearly the sonnar 4/135 of 1932.
The last not had a splitted rear element like the nikon lens. That splitted element is only in gauss 5 elements like biometars, xenotars o planars?
The answer is NO. See the Takumar 2/58 (a sonnar schame). It has the rear splitted element like the nikon 105.
2- The nikon 105 has not a multielement second frontal group. This question don't let the 105 be a sonnar schame?
The sonnar 2,8/180 1954 version and the sonnar 60° of 1938 has only three frontal elements, like the nikkor 105.
3- Seems to be compatibility between the schames of the last 2,5/105 and the sonnars lenses.
Based in the known
http://www.taunusreiter.de/Cameras/Biotar_en.html
http://www.luciolepri.it/lc2/marcocavina/articoli_fotografici/Bertele_Sonnar/00_pag.htm
Rino. _________________ Konica 2,8/100
CZJ: 4/20, 2,4/35, 1,8/50 aus jena, 3,5/135MC, Pentacon 1,8/50
Pentax S-M-C-1,4/50
Helios 44-3
Mamiya 2,8/135
Misc. : jupiter 9
Stuff used:
A) SRL
Alpa 10 D - kern macro Switar 1,9/50 -black, Kilffit apochromat 2/100.
Asahi pentax spotmatic super takumar 1,4/50
Contaflex super B tessar 2,8/50 Pro-tessar 115
Leica R3 electronic summicron 2/50 elmarit 2,8/35
Konica Autoreflex 3 (2 black and chrome one), TC, T4. 2,8/24, 3,5/28 not MC and MC, 1,8/40, 1,4/50, 1,7/50 MC and not MC, 1,8/85, 3,2/135, 3,5/135, 4/200
Minolta XG9 2,8/35, 2/45, 3,5/135
Nikkormat FTn 1,4/50, 2,8/135
Fujica ST 801, 605, 705n. 3,5/19, 1,4/50, 1,8/55, 4/85, 3,5/135.
Praktica MTL 5 and a lot of M42 lenses.
Voigtlander. Bessamatic m, bessamatix de luxe, bessamatic cs, ultramatic and ultramatic cs.
Skoparex 3,5/35, skopagon 2/40, skopar 2,8/50, skopar X 2,8/50, super lanthar (out of catalogue) 2,8/50, dinarex 3,4/90, dinarex 4,8/100, super dinarex 4/135, super dinarex 4/200, zoomar 2,8/36-83, portrait lens 0, 1 and 2. Curtagon 4/28 and 2,8/35
Canon AV1, 1,8/50
Rolleiflex SL35 and SL35 E. 2,8/35 angulon, 2,8/35 distagon, 1,4/55 rolleinar, 1,8/50 planar, 4/135 tessar, 2,8/135 rolleinar, x2 rollei, M42 to rollei adap.
Etc.
RF
Yashica Minister III
Voightlander Vito, vitomatic I, Vito C, etc.
Leica M. M2, M3 (d.s.) and M4. Schenider 3,4/21, 2/35 summaron 2,8/35 (with eyes). Summicron 2/35 (8 elements with eyes), 2/35 chrome, 2/35 black, 1,4/35 pre asph and aspheric - old -, 2/40 summicron, 2,8/50 elmar, 2/50 7 elements, 2/50 DR, 2/50 - minolta version, 1,4/50 summilux 1966 version, 1,4/75 summilux, 2/90 large version, 2/90 reduced version of 1987, 2,8/90 elmarit large version, 4/135 elmar. |
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